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Is Vrayforc4D Marginally Better Than The Native Physical Render Engine In R13?


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#21 StCanas

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 06:40 AM

Perhaps it has more to do with geography, money and a lack of company focus on communications and training. I do not live in europe so I do not have the oppotutnity to go to any of the trade shows they attend, the company produces no comprehensive beginner or advanded written or video tutorials, there is no built in or contextual help system , I don't have serveral thousands of dollars to buy small group classroom training given by the founder. It seems to me that you really have to work at it if you want to get infromation that is widely available at little or no cost to Cinema 4D users on the AR3. So you are right, the inside information is available if you have the money, live in europe or have time to travel there and go to all the trade shows and parties. If you want to know something you have to hunt through hundreds of pages of forum posts to find the answer. I spent $1000 on a product that after 3 or four years I still have no real grasp on how to get the results I want. Thankfully now they have dozens of render presets that can usually give me the results I want.


I've found it pretty easy to get to grips with. Certainly no harder than any other software I have. I think the main thing to remember is that Vray is not nearly as complex as it seems and you're probably going to ignore at least 60% of the settings 80% of the time.

Cheers
Karl;

#22 spedler

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 07:33 AM

I get the impression that there are cerrtain groups close to the VayForC4D company that have access to inside information which is not made public and they use that to their advantage. A practice like that is not ethical and is not good for business, I can not prove it but that is the impression I get. When one pays for a publically avaiable product then they should have equal access to the information on how to use that product, especially when it costs over $1000.


I would strongly disagree and I think it's a very unfair thing to say about the creators of Vray for C4D. I've owned Vray ever since it was first released and I've never seen the slightest hint of this. What they have done is try to restrict technical support to registered users (i.e. people who have actually paid for it) and I don't see anything wrong with that.

But as far as I know there is no clique or elite group favoured above everyone else. With Vray it isn't a click-and-render solution, true, you do have to put some work into understanding it. But if you do it becomes straightforward enough to use. And Stefan is very helpful and patient with inexperienced users.

#23 mmVRay

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:01 AM

I think there is an air of insider elitism on their forum. I have never personally been mistreated but I have noticed some people who ask basic questions are summarily dismissed or ignored while others get the red carpet treatment. This is kind of apauling to me, after spending a lot of money on the product you now have to grovel to get answers to basic questions? I have noticed that the traffic on the forums has dropped off considerably in the last year or two and I think this is the reason. When some spends over $1000 on an product they expect prompt, friendly support and part of that support includes tutorials both written and video. There are other rendering options now and more coming on line every day, I think it has hurt them.

I feel pretty certain that I am not the only one with this impression. The solution is to realize that the render engine market is much more competetive than it was 3 years ago and to make some changes to give people the support they expect.

Edited by mmVRay, 08 February 2012 - 08:19 AM.

Cheers, mmVRay

#24 hulaboy

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:20 AM

I don't want to get into the discussion on how well the VrayforC4D forum works, or doesn't, but I do think that a more comprehensive and 'deeper' user guide would be a good move. The current wiki-style manual is incomplete (at least in its English form), and some of the descriptions it contains are pretty cryptic (this may sometimes be a translation issue), or unhelpfully brief, or both.

Mark

#25 spedler

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:44 AM

I'd agree about the manual. In the early days of Vray for C4D I offered to update it for them and make it a bit more readable. I did a lot of work on it but in the end they junked it all and kept on with the slightly sad documentation they have at the moment.

Incidentally, for anyone with a Kindle, there's an ebook available on Vray for C4D textures. Quite interesting to see this as an ebook. I bought a copy but haven't looked at in detail yet. You can find it here on Amazon.

#26 StCanas

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:51 AM

In the early days of Vray for C4D I offered to update it for them and make it a bit more readable. I did a lot of work on it but in the end they junked it all and kept on with the slightly sad documentation they have at the moment.


Ha! I did exactly the same thing. Went through the whole thing and corrected all the pokey English which resulted in it being a much easier and more helpful read. All I got in return was a rather terse "Er... why would you want to do that?" off Stefan.

Cheers
Karl

#27 brasco

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:59 AM

I find almost all vray for max tuts can translate well, does require having a decent base knowledge though.
There's quite a few good example scene files when you buy vray so it doesn't take long to pick it apart and get going.

This is kind of apauling to me, after spending a lot of money on the product you now have to grovel to get answers to basic questions?


Genuinely have never felt this or seen it on the forums, maybe you're reading too much in between the lines of some posts,Maybe a lot is lost in translation? You can email Stefan at any time to get support or go to the forums "registered users area" to get a quick response.


cheers
brasc

#28 StCanas

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 09:04 AM

Genuinely have never felt this or seen it on the forums


The only thing I'd say about the Vray forum is that you're more likely to get a good response if you post something architecturally realted than any other subject which means you'll get less attention if you're not an archviz guy. Understandable though as Vray is so big in the atchviz world.

Cheers
Karl

#29 brasco

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 09:10 AM

I'll keep an eye out maybe I'll witness it, the Archviz definitely dominates as you say, probably also because Stefan is a visualiser!
I used to be a visualiser so maybe that's why I've not had any issue, I've only been using it for a year though and not much viz.

cheers
brasc




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