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adamjm

rendering a product

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adamjm    0

Hi Guys,

I've built and tried to render this product.. I have ambient inclusion and GI selected.. but it's taking forever to render.. any tips would be great? Have i got too many lights? or is the model too big in terms of height?

I would also like to get a reflection of the HDRI image on the product.. how do i achieve this?

 

Also the bottom part is glass, but i can't seem to get the ideal effect i want. 

 

any advice would be great.. file is attached

 

thanks 

shisha pipe v2.c4d

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SolarPH    6
3 hours ago, adamjm said:

Hi Guys,

I've built and tried to render this product.. I have ambient inclusion and GI selected.. but it's taking forever to render.. any tips would be great? Have i got too many lights? or is the model too big in terms of height?

I would also like to get a reflection of the HDRI image on the product.. how do i achieve this?

 

Also the bottom part is glass, but i can't seem to get the ideal effect i want. 

 

any advice would be great.. file is attached

 

thanks 

shisha pipe v2.c4d

I can't look into your scene file completely. you have a missing texture file "studioG.jpg". in Mat1

 

Did you used any presets that have the image file name "studioG.jpg"?

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SolarPH    6

Just my guess. The part where your renderer works too long is when it passes the glass part of the model, right?

 

It is because of it's material.

 

Having fresnel on both Color and Bump, then also having transparency will make your renderer work long on that part of object. Render time doesn't get stuck because of the model height. It will vary depending on how many complex textures it have.

 

In the case of your object, the current main cause of the problem is the material assigned in the bottom of the bottle.

 

Even not having the GI and AO enabled, the render time will still take long.

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Decarlo    17

Agreed, fresnel on the bump doesn't make sense and it seems to be hogging a lot of processing. 

 

You did not include the HDRI image file (studioG.jpg) but it needs to be in the luminance channel of your sky material. That way, it actually emits the dynamic studio lighting you're trying to achieve with the GI.  You can also drop the HDRI image into the "Environment" channel of the glass and the HDRI will be used for reflection.  Once you've actually got the HDRI working, turn off all your lights. The point of the HDRI is for it to be your main light source. Then turn individual lights back on only if you think you need what that light adds. That should have a significant impact on render times.

 

I'm not sure what effect you're trying to achieve with the glass.  If it's just normal, transparent glass, then you need to increase the refraction (there's a "glass" preset of 1.517.  This will produce the dynamic colors in the edges of the glass. I think that's what you're trying to force with the fresnel in the color channel. That needs to go (assuming you just want regular glass).  If you want it to have a little color, or be  a little opaque, mess with the "absorption" settings in the transparency channel.  

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adamjm    0

that's great thanks guys.. I'm slowly getting my head around this.. I've done a few paid projects now.. but have been lucky not to be working in glass :)

 

I'd like to be able to render a high res spirit bottle eventually 

 

thanks again anyway 

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adamjm    0

hi guys, i've added a few screen shots of the model, but i still think the glass isn't right.. Im also getting a black dot at the base of the glass.. any ideas on what i need to add to get better definition, like the black reflections you get around the glass edges?

 

any further advice would be great.. ps that's the hdri image in the background obviously, but if i turn it off the background goes black.

 

thanks 

Screen Shot 2017-10-12 at 20.10.21.png

Screen Shot 2017-10-12 at 20.13.54.png

Screen Shot 2017-10-12 at 20.14.03.png

Screen Shot 2017-10-12 at 20.15.06.png

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Decarlo    17

Your model is going through the "table." Very carefully place the points of your spline right above the plane of the table. You also have zero shadows falling onto the surface, which makes it look like it is floating in a void.  Anti-aliasing will go a long way with pixellation the glass, though it will also kill your render times.  Such is life.

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ninjad    9

Oof, hate to bust your chops, but if you're going to ask folks to look at your file you should at least take the time to label and organize things. When you go to the doctor wear clean underware, and when you send people files label and organize!

 

When saving out a project go to File>Save Project with Assets... and it will save everything including textures to a folder that you can zip up and send.

 

The main reason rendering is slow is because the settings are out of whack. When using GI switch to Physical. Then in the Physical settings choose Sampler:Adaptive and Sampling Quality:Low

 

In Global Illumination keep Irradiance Cache for Primary Method

Select Samples:Custom Sample Count

Twirl down the Samples settings (little black arrow) and set Sample Count: 10

 

I would disable Discrete Sky Sampling

 

And in the Irradiance Cache tab I would try out Record Density Low or Preview to start out, and you should see you render times go down a lot.

 

Also your glass material is a real mess. Remove the Color & Bump Channels. In the Reflection Channel, delete the Default Specular, and add a Beckman shader. Scroll down to Layer Fresnel, select Layer:Dialectic, Preset:Glass

 

In the Transparency Channel select Refraction Preset:Glass

 

One last thing, you should do some searches for "lighting glass product shots" product photography has been around since dirt and learning how things are done in the real world can really help setup your scenes.

 

Your Welcome! :)

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VECTOR    335

Also i might add you don't need gi for this, it's really not going to make a huge difference to such a simple object/and scene. turn off gi/ and add a couple more lights to compensate if needed, also check your values in the physical renderer options tab, mainly reflection depth/ ray depth / shadow depth. lowering these along with turning off gi will decrease your render times

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SolarPH    6
52 minutes ago, ninjad said:

When saving out a project go to File>Save Project with Assets... and it will save everything including textures to a folder that you can zip up and send.

There was a flaw in that method sometimes, but since the bitmap name did the format "Name.Format" instead of "Directory/Name.Format", it is impossible that the image is from a preset.

 

Also, if you used a texture image that is saved in the preset, the image won't be saved in the tex folder of the project.

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adamjm    0

Thanks for the Feedback guys..  much appreciated  

 

Ninjad, I've not long been using C4d, yes my glass is a mess that's why I'm posting here.. and asking questions!!! :)

Also i'm running prime so not privileged to have a full version as yet. I've noticed that things are laid out differently as i've used the full version and prime.. so have seen quite a big difference.

 

A lot of the videos i've watched make it look very easy, glass seems really tricky.. one video shows a guy just dropping glass onto a model and it looks great, but i bet it took him a while to set up the scene the object was in.

 

I shall take on board the comments.. 

thanks again

 

 

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ninjad    9
21 hours ago, adamjm said:

Thanks for the Feedback guys..  much appreciated  

 

Ninjad, I've not long been using C4d, yes my glass is a mess that's why I'm posting here.. and asking questions!!! :)

Also i'm running prime so not privileged to have a full version as yet. I've noticed that things are laid out differently as i've used the full version and prime.. so have seen quite a big difference.

 

No worries, you're kind of packing a lot of issues into one topic. A lot of the individual issues you are having are very basic parts of the application so you might want to spend more time getting to know the software before putting yourself in a deadline situation.

 

That said, getting to pick apart a beginner project can be a bit of a guilty pleasure :) Don't take it personal, I just assume you're looking for honest feedback.

 

Good luck with your project!

 

PS - One last bit about the glass material, you actually don't need a reflection channel if your transparency brightness is at 100%. The only time you would want to use reflection with transparency is if you want to control the reflection brightness separate from the transparency brightness or do something funky like use a different fresnel value.

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