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MAXON brings new CEO on board! New Future!!

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Isleofgough    28

I agree with you, Dan. I have already paid my MSA renewal for C4D studio, so I will have R20; but this will be my last upgrade to this program. The real cost of all the addins, coupled with the MSA price increase, makes this hard to support  - without doing this full time in a paid position. I came to the same conclusion about Avid Media Composer, where the real cost was spread out among lots of other programs that were needed to make up for the deficiencies in the base program itself. I expect I will keep either C4D R20 or an older version of Modo for quick modeling. I've been moving toward Houdini for my purposes, and the real cost of maintaining a license and the need for fewer addins make this more realistic for my needs (plus I find it more "fun"). For the fun of it, I replicated Jay's method for a soap dish dispenser in Houdini, and it was pretty easy.

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Rectro    675
8 minutes ago, Isleofgough said:

I expect I will keep either C4D R20 or an older version of Modo for quick modeling. I've been moving toward Houdini for my purposes, and the real cost of maintaining a license and the need for fewer addins make this more realistic for my needs 

Modo is a awesome modeller, I hope C4D exceeds it one day, and offers as good of a solution to its topology tools, but to do that it needs to develop very fast.  The good thing is unlike when I started back in 1993 there are free alternitives such as Blender, Sculptris, Gimp, Natron to give a hobbiest some awesome tools.

 

Dan

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JLeaburn    25
1 hour ago, Isleofgough said:

I agree with you, Dan. I have already paid my MSA renewal for C4D studio, so I will have R20; but this will be my last upgrade to this program. The real cost of all the addins, coupled with the MSA price increase, makes this hard to support  - without doing this full time in a paid position. 

3

Pretty much the same as me. I bought two years of the MSA last time so I get R20 this year without the payout. I have had next to no time using C4D for the last year, mainly because I was working heavy shifts on a permanent night shift and another reason I've not really been present here at the Cafe. 

Luckily, today I got an offer of a new job which I start next week. Day shifts and half day Fridays. Sounds so good after night shifts. Hopefully, I will get back to C4D in a major fashion.  If R20 is the killer version that we all hope for then I'll stick with C4D, if not then expect an R20 Studio to be up for sale.

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thanulee    20

C4d as any other software, cant excel at everything. Imo mograph is the reason c4d is famous, and not modelling or char animation or any of traditional 3d stuff that other 3d softwares provide I also believe that u can not do anything in one software due to the complexity of 3d in general. Would be lovely to paint as in SP2 inside c4d, or to have booleans like Meshfusion etc but thats not possible and will never happen in a single software. C4d is strong on almost every aspect btw.

That being said, the more i test c4d in production, the more i realise that is the only software i ever used that doesnt crash :) Being a 15 year old 3dsmax user, switching to c4d has been a breeze for me. I wouldnt mind if not a single feature was added, in order for multithread to be implemented (as its rumoured for R20). I think that inside c4d only thing can drag u down atm is performance and ur imagination and not its toolset which i find adequate for many many situations. Sure houdini is a beast atm, but its learning curve is not for everyone + the major difference i see with c4d is that u can use all ur system resources. Sure u need xparticles to do stuff, or TFD or tones of plugins, but realistically speaking check eg. AE: It needs tones of plugins to function to its potential.

Long story short, i wish for a good performance boost in R20 plus an indie licence plan, that would help tones of freelancers to jump on board.

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Visionnext    77
9 hours ago, thanulee said:

C4d as any other software, cant excel at everything. Imo mograph is the reason c4d is famous, and not modelling or char animation or any of traditional 3d stuff that other 3d softwares provide I also believe that u can not do anything in one software due to the complexity of 3d in general. Would be lovely to paint as in SP2 inside c4d, or to have booleans like Meshfusion etc but thats not possible and will never happen in a single software. C4d is strong on almost every aspect btw.

I agree with you, but C4D was my first choice because of the simplicity of usage and because it was a general workhorse.

I'm not into mograph though and more into characters like @Rectro. C4D started to develop character features, but it seems that significant features are still missing. On the other hand, MAXON is not good in communicating about their future feature focus.

 

Maybe the future is to have several programs to work together with capable file exchange formats (FBX import by MAXON still has various deficits, reordering of vertices in OBJs is a real mess), which makes it possible to work with different versions of these programs together. Plugins are nice, but you always have the troubles of updating them and sometimes their instability even crashes C4D. I get R20 via MSA as well and I wll see what they will provide. Although I have R19, I'm still using R18 in order to keep my workflow stable.

 

IMHO MAXON should concentrate on specific features as best in class and provide open interfaces (stable and standardized file exchange). Thus it will be easier to fill specific gaps with other programs. 

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thanulee    20

I strongly believe if u are into characters u should be looking at Maya, as whole industry is there. Is like if u wanna model u need to know Zbrush etc. There are industry standard softwares and despite our personal workflows or prefs, we need to tag along. I dont believe that the future is to have several programs; the situation was always like this. There is not one to rule em all :D 
Dont be afraid to jump on another ship imo if what u are using gives u troubles, even if that costs u at first, eventually its a win win for u. Cheers 

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Frokito    6
9 minutes ago, thanulee said:

I strongly believe if u are into characters u should be looking at Maya, as whole industry is there. Is like if u wanna model u need to know Zbrush etc. There are industry standard softwares and despite our personal workflows or prefs, we need to tag along. I dont believe that the future is to have several programs; the situation was always like this. There is not one to rule em all :D 
Dont be afraid to jump on another ship imo if what u are using gives u troubles, even if that costs u at first, eventually its a win win for u. Cheers 

People have already years invested in Cinema 4D. I don't see myself learning another program just to animate and rig characters. Its takes time and money to learn another program unless that the only area that someone wants to focus on.

It would be great if MAXON and improve the features which are neglected for some time now. But I'm also into characters and I love cinema's ease of use to rig characters. I would love to see them make the character toolset better.

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RLaskey    25
20 minutes ago, Frokito said:

People have already years invested in Cinema 4D. I don't see myself learning another program just to animate and rig characters. Its takes time and money to learn another program unless that the only area that someone wants to focus on.

It would be great if MAXON and improve the features which are neglected for some time now. But I'm also into characters and I love cinema's ease of use to rig characters. I would love to see them make the character toolset better.

I agree.

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Rectro    675
2 hours ago, thanulee said:

I strongly believe if u are into characters u should be looking at Maya, as whole industry is there. Is like if u wanna model u need to know Zbrush etc. There are industry standard softwares and despite our personal workflows or prefs, we need to tag along. I dont believe that the future is to have several programs; the situation was always like this. There is not one to rule em all :D 
Dont be afraid to jump on another ship imo if what u are using gives u troubles, even if that costs u at first, eventually its a win win for u. Cheers 

There are many programs that deal with character focused work and your right as I well also know Maya is the app of choice, but there are many reasons that is the case and its not just because its better, but because the industry has adopted its workflow, invested allot of money into scripting, and training. The grass is never greener on every patch of the turf for other software equivalents but there is a devide as why someone goes between either C4D or Maya.

 

So back to the initial point that there are many programs out there that is dedicated to character work. There is a defining point between high end tools for professional results, and serious hobbyist, to generalised hobbyist that dont have these high end expectations and are happy to play.  They are all valid in their own right but the cross over point is between the serious Hobbyist, freelance Professional, and full time professional whom works within a studio.

 

I know many whom fit within both the serious Hobbyist and part time professional freelancer where 3D is not their sole source of income yet both for their own personal serious Hobby in making higher end industry quality art, and the odd freelance work requires the same quality outcome yet this cant be done with just any tool.  The time and money it takes to get very proficient in a app is significant, the on going cost to keep a subscription alive only when you can afford it, or have some work pushes out the serious hobbyist, nobody can keep the cost of Maya for personal work, and that is where C4D fits in.  C4D has a artist friendly ease of use that you do not get in Maya according to many I know whom use it, Maya is very complex, very expensive to keep up the maintenance costs in which you need to be earning from it regularly to keep its costs going.

 

Peoples circumstances change such as income, bills, health, age and if one had in the past times initially invested outright in a perpetual licence when their circumstances where much better then they still have that perpetual licence for life giving them the same tool they know well, still being able to produce great art work, and get the odd job.  While Maya may be the app of choice for character work, its not a ideal choice for many because of the above reasons.

 

Dan

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14 hours ago, thanulee said:

 I think that inside c4d only thing can drag u down atm is performance and ur imagination and not its toolset which i find adequate for many many situations.

Well, it certainly depends on the job, but I'd say that limited options also limit you. See, for example, the UV toolset.

And that's not the only area where C4D is lagging behind.

"Adequate" is also not much of a praise. :) There must be something between adequate and the best at everything.

 

And yes, mograph is C4D's main selling point, but will they be able to live only on that and leave other features lagging behind everybody else?

Maya already tries to bite into the mograph market share. Houdini is of course its own thing, and maybe not an alternative for many because of its learning curve, but it can do anything Mograph does and more. Hey, I guess I can even mention Blender, which I doubt will ever get big in the industry, but they are working on implementing stuff that will make motion graphics actually possible and much easier than Houdini there too.

 

Regarding performance, while it would be awesome, I'm not sure how possible it is to increase it significantly. I think it's much harder to squeeze performance out of hardware that just doesn't increase in power as it used to than it is to add and improve features.

 

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thanulee    20

Valid points there. The way I see it, is that if something doesnt suit u, u change it. Either a gf or a software :D
If u are a hobbyist then yea, its annoying that u miss the tools from the software u love.

 If u are a professional though, thats another story and u need to adapt. Last 2 years i learned and applied to actual jobs (or tried to a degree) substance/nuke/octane/c4d/xparticles/tfd/realflow/world creator etc etc 
Ye it takes money sure. And it was/is rough i can tell u that. But the outcome of this research, is a lot more jobs, and a lot more money. I could easily say "i work  on 3dsmax for 15 years no way i leave it now". Its the nature of this job that requires u to be on top of new technologies.

Ye c4d might not be perfect, but its a great tool and im surprised reading people complaining about MAXON neglecting features :) I think it covers pretty much everything to a very good degree.  Try autodesk for half of ur life and u ll understand where im coming from :D 
 

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MauricioPC    47
On 7/12/2018 at 3:57 AM, 3DKiwi said:

 

If it's the big one that we hope and expect it to be I may just buy the Prime version. I could then use both Modo and C4D. Ironically at the moment I'm doing a Blender hard surface and robot modelling course and learning Blender although I may use Modo instead for the Robot part of the course. I'm using Bforartists rather than the regular Blender.

Very interesting and I'm following your reports on the Blender thread. If R20 is all that, I might get it as well. Let's see ... I'm a bit disappointed with Modo lately.

 

23 hours ago, thanulee said:

 If u are a professional though, thats another story and u need to adapt. 

 

Yeah, but Max is a powerhouse. Why did you change? You work is very good and you could probably live as a freelancer. So why change Max to C4D?

 

Maya is good for characters if you are animating. If it's modeling, you could use Max to more effect even, but C4D and Modo are suitable alternatives.

 

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