Jump to content

Intenditore

A bunch of proposals to improve C4D

Recommended Posts

Hi!

For the beginning let me express my respect and warm filings for MAXON team, that's rare nowadays when people think about another people and their needs and not only the profits. Congrats for upcoming r20 release as well!

To the point...

Despite the UX in C4D is superb relative to many others, there are some pretty evident problems. I don't want to touch modelling yet (but I do have A LOT to say about, both improving particular tools and ways to improve it at the whole), instead let me show you the growing list of fixes I propose. I constantly add new ideas while working, so it's a bit messy, but - I don't know do you, guys, need it and will you ever listen to my thoughts. So I want to start this topic to understand is that needed at all (I did something like this for Adobe and they didn't even bother to answer) and may I take a part at evolving my favourite software?

If regular Cafe visitors have something to add - welcome!

 

While "Split" duplicate object without children. Delete points of splited geometry;
While "align center" window is active dont't apply the changes to pivot untill the "execute" button is pressed as it's too easy to mess with pivot simply selecting object;
Delete polygons with corresponding points by default;
Fast "key selected attr" as Q in timeline - when autokey sets the keys for all the parameters it's a bit inconvinient;
Fix "render instances", make them like real instances. For now they disappear as soon as we work with them as real objects, putting in symmetry or any other generator. It must work like if you work with a bunch of Instance objects, not like now;
Less nulls - there's no real reason why we must group geometry in null to put it in SDS or symmetry. But we have to still, seems to have no point;
Cloner negative offset! It's really needed feature to have a way to shift cloner in opposite way than it's possible now;
Consider null the object of size of it's content. It's really needed for "fit to parent", axis manipulation and similar things;
Add a way to dock attribute manager under the dope sheet object list to see key parameters immidiately;
Add a "Show in Solo mode" in Interaction tag;
Don't gray out snap options when it's turned off, it is rather inconvinient than logical;
One click solo activation with last used settings. Hierarchy turned on by default. Messing with flyout menu every time is time-consuming and not pleasant;
Disable all calculation of objects outside of Solo or hidden by "traffic light", Solo must speed up scnene, now that's a major issue;
Timeline selection presets as "selection" objects in OM;
"Centre axis to" and other commands must not retain the behaviour defined by "Center axis" dialog;
Autokey only active (selected) dimensions option;
Committe Knife, Weld and so on by Enter or Right click;

IMPORTANT!
In timeline - DO NOT SHOW child keys on parent!!! AT LEAST as an option. Now selecting keys and even getting an idea of what's going on is a tricky endevaour!;
By clicking on the object in timeline ONLY select it's own keys, selecting it's and children's keys is possible via middle click already. For now it's such a pain to work with that;
Colour-code Summary track and add a margin to separate it from the rest of timeline, it must ease getting around with happening in the scene;

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Adobe has a new feature request forum that actually gets quite a lot of interaction from fellow users and occasionally useful input from Adobe staff these days. You might look into that. Although, I will say that it's best to post several feature requests with specific details about one feature per request rather than a big list. Big lists can't be voted on or organized like individual requests can. :)

 

Speaking of which, MAXON also has a suggestion page. I'd recommend the same thing. Make a separate post to them per item you'd like to see changed. It's a lot easier for them to keep that sort of thing organized. MAXON, like Adobe, really appreciates user feedback like that, even if they can't respond.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also, some of the stuff you mentioned (deleting polygons deletes the points too, for example) are included in R20 which was announced today. :)

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Topic Author
  • I have started this thread after seeing @Glenster's message in r20 release discussion. He says if anybody has own thoughts on improving modelling toolkit he'd like to hear it. So I hope this is the way to share opinion too.

    Speaking of modelling I have lot to say too if anybody's interested

    @Greatszalam I saw those discussion forums. There's a lot of old but still hot threads about self-evident improvements and fixes people are waiting for YEARS and no reaction from Adobe. I started hating them for their neglect in relation to own users. The level of evolution of their products is just awful. They are degrading even. So nope, I can't agree with you in this relation

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    For the split command, it's better to use a modifier key to erase (like perfect slip script) or keep the source polygons. Something I already sent to the MAXON suggestion page several years ago.

     

    Same thing with the solo command, everybody still use Magic Solo because it's just one click. I already pleaded MAXON to use just one button and use modifier keys for other options.

     

    For R20 I read C4D finally erases remaining points by default when deleting polygons but keeps them with the shift modifier key.

    • Like 1

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites
    8 hours ago, Greatszalam said:

    Adobe has a new feature request forum that actually gets quite a lot of interaction from fellow users and occasionally useful input from Adobe staff these days. You might look into that. Although, I will say that it's best to post several feature requests with specific details about one feature per request rather than a big list. Big lists can't be voted on or organized like individual requests can. :)

     

    Speaking of which, MAXON also has a suggestion page. I'd recommend the same thing. Make a separate post to them per item you'd like to see changed. It's a lot easier for them to keep that sort of thing organized. MAXON, like Adobe, really appreciates user feedback like that, even if they can't respond.

     

    Something the new CEO can bring without hesitation from Adobe is this new feature request forum as the MAXON suggestion page has always been like a black hole where users, I'm pretty sure, ask for the same features again and again without knowing if their requests will be taken into account. 

    • Like 1

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites
  • Topic Author
  • I keep adding items in the list. Not sure now will anybody in MAXON read it, but I hope so.

    Happily, Cinema is not the program that needs all-new approach and logic (except modeling module) but there's still a lot of places for improvements

     

    GENERAL

    While "align center" window is active dont't apply the changes to pivot untill the "execute" button is pressed as it's too easy to mess with pivot simply selecting object;
    "Center axis to" and other commands must not retain the behaviour defined by "Center axis" dialog;
    Fast "key selected attr" as Q in timeline - when autokey sets the keys for all the parameters it's a bit inconvinient;
    Fix "render instances", make them like real instances. For now they disappear as soon as we work with them as real objects, putting in symmetry or any other generator. It must work like if you work with a bunch of Instance objects, not like now;
    Less nulls - there's no real reason why we must group geometry in null to put it in SDS or symmetry. But we have to still, seems to have no point;
    Cloner negative offset! It's really needed feature to have a way to shift cloner in opposite way than it's possible now;
    Consider null the object of size of it's content. It's really needed for "fit to parent", axis manipulation and similar things;
    Add a way to dock attribute manager under the dope sheet object list to see key parameters immidiately;
    Add a "Show in Solo mode" in Interaction tag;
    Don't gray out snap options when it's turned off, it is rather inconvinient than logical;
    One click solo activation with last used settings. Hierachy turned on by default. Messing with flyout menu every time is time-consuming and not pleasant;
    Disable all calculation of objects outside of Solo or hidden by "traffic light", Solo must speed up the scnene, now it does not really;
    Committe Knife, Weld and so on by Enter or Right click or Enter;
    When "effector" in "filter" menu is off it still shows in instances and cloners - must be fixed;
    Individual "filter" menu settings for each vieport (or possible ovveride system), adding a "file" grabber for filter menu to make it floating window;
    Make backlite respect the compositing tag "exclude" feature. Now it doesn't;
    A few operands for Boolean and Spline Mask;
    Fix UV scale. It's damn weired! (DONE)
    Simultaneaous rendering and files saving - sometimes save process takes a long time and render is paused while that;
    Make an easy way to control non-PSR parameters with deformers and effectors. We really lack it;
    Don't colour clones by default;
    Add "transparent" option in Display tag;


    TIMELINE

    By clicking on the object in timeline ONLY select it's own keys, selecting it's and children's keys is possible via middle click already. For now it's such a pain to work with that if you need to tweak anly parent animation. AT LEAST as an option. ;
    Colour-code Summary track and add a margin to separate it from the rest of timeline, it must ease getting around with what's happening in the scene;
    Colour-code animation parameters in timeline according to curves colour;
    Always show Velocity curve representation by default;
    Add AE-like "speed graph" mode (velocity curve editing);
    Add an option "don't keep playing after scrabbing";
    Make velocity reference curve fit background with no respect to scales on the side so we can see simply the relative speed values not changing the view;
    AE-like system to control trajectory and velocity separately. Introduce editable velocity curves in timeline;
    An option to stop playback on scrubbing;
    "Solo track on object" - turn off all the rest of animation but ONLY for this object. The rest of them remain animated;
    FIX THIS (copypasting keyframes) https://www.c4dcafe.com/ipb/forums/topic/94518-copy-paste-keyframes/
    Autokey only active (selected, or keyed alredy) dimentions option;
    "Keep visual angle" for tangents by default;
    Possibility to animate in world-space even inside parent object;
    Hide "tracks" folder;
    Syncronize animations channels folding and unfolding for selested objects;
    Shortcuts for toggling parameters like in AE (PSR, for instance);
    Store the state of selections in timeline for each object respectevely and restore it when the object is reselected again;
    Add new animated parameters to "solo" mode when it was enabled already before creating new animation (another way that's confusing how it works, make user think something is broken);
    Remember graph scale for each selected parameter indivigually not to frame it evety time we switch;
    Timeline selection presets as "selection" objects in OM;


    MODELIND:
    Delete polygons with corresponding points by default; (DONE)
    While "Split" duplicate object without children. Delete points of splited geometry;
    "Toggle parent generator" must turn off all generators or SDS. Now it works unpredictable. I think there must be some switch or tag to make particular generators stay on even when "toggle" feature is off. Also, wherever is the geomtry in cloner, connect or any other generator, the visibility and editablity of mesh must be preserved. Now it's not working that way. Also fix the same problem with Bevel defromer;
    "Bend" is awful. It needs to be much more intuitive and flexible, take as a reference 3ds max's one, it's much, much friendlier. Also there needs to be a fast way to bend object symmetrically in two ways (butterfly-like way);
    NEW: DEDICATED MODELING TOOLBAR! Including: fast axis switch (available in all modes with two "recent settings" buttuns to store setting for fast access without using dropdown menu);
    Merge Regtangle (and other variation) selection with Move/Scale/Rotate and others;
    "Pivot to base" or "base to pivot" for primitives;
    Spline pivot to Bbox centre;

     

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Do I guess correctly that you are coming from a different 3D environment? :)

     

    You should submit a request to join MAXON's beta team; you've obviously willing to put in the details on the reporting side. Not only would you probably provide some perspective from other workflows but you would also learn why MAXON chose to do certain things they way they did.

     

    • Awesome 1

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites
  • Topic Author
  • 2 hours ago, Zmotive said:

    Do I guess correctly that you are coming from a different 3D environment? :)

     

    You should submit a request to join MAXON's beta team; you've obviously willing to put in the details on the reporting side. Not only would you probably provide some perspective from other workflows but you would also learn why MAXON chose to do certain things they way they did.

     

    What a nice idea! I will try join them, thanks!

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites
  • Topic Author
  • And yes you're right, I initially was a hard 3ds max user but 3 years have switched to Cinema and never went back (except for modelling)

    But currently i'm in the state when I'm not searching for any parallels or similarities between the programs, I use it freely and have no problems with that (again, except modelling :D)

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Create an account or sign in to comment

    You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

    Create an account

    Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

    Register a new account

    Sign in

    Already have an account? Sign in here.

    Sign In Now

    • Recently Browsing   0 members

      No registered users viewing this page.

    ×