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Manny Jimenez

Normal Map seams on Subdivided mesh.

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Hi everyone, 

 

I couple of days ago, I made a post trying to figure out why my mesh was rendering weird seams when applying a normal map. The solution seemed to be to select the edges that corresponded my UV map borders and apply "Break Phong Shading" to them. 

 

The problem is now when I try to subdivide that mesh, the shading errors come back along the seams. Does anyone know what I'm doing wrong? I can't find anything online about this issue.

 

I've provided the project file and here's a link to the normal map:

https://app.box.com/s/evm7hid6lbvwjg84rslorz5hrmzalxiv

 

Thanks!

 

SEAMS_TEST_v5.c4d

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15 minutes ago, Manny Jimenez said:

Does anyone know what I'm doing wrong?

Yes. Subdivision in Cinema does not support smoothing groups, or phong breaks as they are called in this program, so I suspect that was not a valid solution if SDS is subsequently involved. I'll have a look at what we can do about this after dinner - I do have some ideas that may or may not work - I'd need to do some tests.

 

In the meantime, just checking you have your SDS object set to Boundary or Edge, rather than Standard - if it was left on default, that would screw up your UVs ! :)

 

CBR

Edited by Cerbera
Added SDS cheat

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  • Hey thanks Cerbera!

     

    I'm so confused here. What is the correct workflow for normal maps and UVs in C4D? Can you not subdivide a model AND have a normal map at the same time? Or do I just need to hide my seams better?

     

    The problem is the entire body of the model is smooth.

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    Yes, you can SDS a model and normal map it - if that didn't work we'd all be lost ! I am getting expected results, but a slightly messy seam - is that the problem you're having ?

     

    118471316_normalseam.thumb.jpg.4ceffff09103da6c7a1ff30ae1f745ab.jpg

     

    CBR

     

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  • Yes thats the problem. I made the normal map in Zbrush. Do you think there's something wrong with the way I unwrapped it?

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    Annoyingly, I don't know, not being a Z-brush user myself. Your polys are excellent, your UVs seem fine, and your Normal Map also looks OK. Which does, alas, mean I am not the person to tell you what's going wrong here. We should see if @Rectro is around, and ask him. Bet he knows ! :)

     

    CBR

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  • Thanks! Did you try anything different? I’d love to try to any of the methods you did. 

     

    Alternatively, Im gonna try UVing in C4D as well. 

     

    Also, yes please @Rectro I’d ypu have any advice, I’d love to hear it :)

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    OK, there may be some bad news. A little Google Fu has found this relatively recent article which rather gives the impression that Cinema simply has a broken implementation of Normal Maps on UV'd objects ! By this guy's account all he had to do was swap to a third Party Renderer and the seams were instantly gone. If it is the case that's very disappointing, and we can add it to the other UV thing Cinema still can't deal with - OpenSubDiv. I'm surprised nobody else here has discovered this in their character workflows - I don't do much character stuff so hadn't run into the issue myself so far, but I would have thought there was a fair few people doing normal maps in Z-brush...

     

    Sorry it's not better news. but if you open a support case with MAXON about it that will hopefully bring it to their renewed attention.

     

    I will just ask - have you tried baking it out as displacement instead ? Maybe that would work where normal maps failed ?

     

    CBR

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    Just for fun, I opened your file in Substance Painter and applied the normal map you created. It's not perfect but it looks better than it does in C4D. 

     

    My usual workflow is C4D>Substance>Unity so I've not noticed this before but I'm going to agree with Cerbera about this being a C4D issue.

     

     

    Seams.jpg

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  • 36 minutes ago, Lonchaney said:

    Just for fun, I opened your file in Substance Painter and applied the normal map you created. It's not perfect but it looks better than it does in C4D. 

     

    My usual workflow is C4D>Substance>Unity so I've not noticed this before but I'm going to agree with Cerbera about this being a C4D issue.

     

     

    Seams.jpg

    I've tried this as well, the problem is when I bring the map from Substance back into C4D, the shading errors are still there. If it's not too much trouble, could you bake out your normal map and try it in C4D? I'd like to confirm I'm not crazy. Lol

     

    So far, I'm getting the same results over two different machines.

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