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Maxon Subscribtion Plan Discussions

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UK prices are up now... 

£55.19 - monthly C4D - 1 year payment

£95.99 - month by month cancel anytime. 

£79.19 - monthly C4D with redshift - 1 year payment

£119.99 - month by month cancel anytime. 

 

Perpetual - £3300

 

Might have to change region at the bottom left to UK 

https://www.MAXON.net/en/buy/

 

But the big problem here is everyone that has a perpetual licence is now royally screwed. There is an FAQ entry which is just confusing

 

"If you own a perpetual license of Cinema 4D, you’re eligible for discounted Cinema 4D subscription pricing. You’re also able to upgrade to an R21 perpetual license. Some future Cinema 4D upgrades may be available only to subscription customers, while others may be available as perpetual licenses at upgrade pricing. Specific timing and pricing of each upgrade is not yet defined."

 

Basically they have just killed the resale value of everyones perpetual licence as there is no price for this upgrade beyond your MSA and " future Cinema 4D upgrades may be available only to subscription customers" which fragments things again!!!! FFS MAXON Cinema 4D sort it out! 

 

it's just a big kick in the nuts for anyone that has just bought it like me.

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Afaik, the problem with shipping updates to perpetual license is not allowed by law if it contains new features, except bugfixes (maybe I am mistaken), therefore it requires version increase and some sort of payment/fee. For subscription this limitation doesn't exist. For example, that means you could get more than one version update in a year by being a subscriber but not as perpetual license owner due to legal implications. Rest assured that MAXON is looking not to cause damage to it's customers, therefore the choice of words there in that part of faq simply reflects that until the solution which will be satisfactory to all is found


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https://www.youtube.com/c4dcafe

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1 hour ago, Raischub said:

I bet my A.. that Cinema will be labeled Adobe in a foreseeable time. .

 

That will probably be MAXON's "Industry Changing" news in 2021. Adobe C4D

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5 minutes ago, Unstable said:

 

That will probably be MAXON's "Industry Changing" news in 2021. Adobe C4D

Not sure how many times we need to tell that Maxon is not for sale. No now, or anytime soon... :) 


| MAXON Quality Assurance Specialist | 3D Asset Creatior | C4D Cafe Manager | Gamer in Heart | :compEnjoy:

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tbh i don't really get what all the fuzz is about. i see no big difference to what things were prior to yesterday. all that has changed is that MAXON is offering more flexible solutions, freeing up dev resources and lowering the entry cost. MSA vs subscription for studio is roughly the same, upgrade prices for perpetual wasn't announced yet, so that's an unknown... pretty sure it will also be ok.

 

also i don't get what the real life difference is between perpetual and subscription if costs are roughly the same.

 

let's play through the following scenarios: 

 

1. assuming you're a professional on perpetual:

 

you own a perpetual license, you upgrade each year. one day you can't afford it anymore because you don't make any money with it anymore. you just wanna use it for your personal stuff as a hobby now, and you're stuck with the version you last upgraded to. 2 or 3 years later at the latest you're drooling at the most amazing new feature in c4d you've ever seen, and then what happens? either you save some money to get back into it, and if that's really not doable you will just download a cracked version and have fun with it, let's be honest.

 

2. assuming you're a professional on subscription:

 

you're on subscription at 60€/month. one day you can't afford it anymore because you don't make any money with it anymore (very unlikely, 60€/month is easily earned in 3D within an hour). you just wanna use it for your personal stuff as a hobby now, and now you have no version you can have fun with. then what happens? either you find a way to spent 60€/month to get back into it, and if that's really not doable you will just download a cracked version and have fun with it, let's be honest.

 

3. assuming you're a hobbyist on perpetual:

 

you own a perpetual license, you upgrade each year. one day you can't afford it anymore because of whatever reason. you're stuck with the version you last upgraded to. 2 or 3 years later at the latest you're drooling at the most amazing new feature in c4d you've ever seen, and then what happens? either you save some money to get back into it, and if that's really not doable you will just download a cracked version and have fun with it, let's be honest.

 

4. assuming you're a hobbyist on subscription:

 

you're on subscription at 60€/month (not that much money for a hobby, even skateboarding is more expensive). one day you can't afford it anymore because of whatever reason. now you have no version you can have fun with. then what happens? either you find a way to spent 60€/month to get back into it, and if that's really not doable you will just download a cracked version and have fun with it, let's be honest.

 

5. assuming you're a hobbyist or a professional on subscription or perpetual and MAXON goes bankrupt:

 

if MAXON ever goes downhill (which i highly doubt) then perpetual and subscription versions won't run anymore. you will HAVE to use a pirated version. after 2 or 3 years at most you will switch to a different software with cool new features.

 

that's all the scenarios i can think of. all basically have the same result. so why the long faces?

 

i'm really not propagating illegal activities here, it's just a depiction of reality, because that's how most of the people on here and elsewhere would act. and btw, blender is free and also nice to learn as a hobby. 

 

so cheer up,  everything is fine, the earth keeps spinning. ;)

 

 

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Unstable said:

 

That will probably be MAXON's "Industry Changing" news in 2021. Adobe C4D

 

I recall people saying that Adobe is buying MAXON from 2008 onwards "really soon" or "next year" :)

 

Simply not happening. Even from purely business perspective it would be to costly for Adobe and they would certainly opt to do their own development


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I thought like that when I was in Brasil and pirated versions was something to be proud of and everybody was doing. After living in the UK, I never used a cracked software and you know what? I love it. It's great to be able to buy or subscribe for something that you like. So instead of going cracked again, I would just use Blender. ;)

 

Actually, even in Brasil I was being nice as I have purchased the R14 student version of Cinema and when that expired I stopped using Cinema. Than I went for Modo which was cheap back then. Nowadays I would just use Blender ... but Max/Maya at $249/year is VERY tempting.

 

 

As for the UK prices ... I'm find with the monthly price as long as I don't have to pay up-front. There's a HUGE difference in payment £60/month (which I could start today) than shelling out £720 up-front. If Adobe can do it in a one-year contract, so should MAXON.

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35 minutes ago, Hrvoje said:

Seems that there are mixed opinions about the upcoming change. I don't know much about the intricate details regarding how MSA customers or perpetual license owners will benefit from this change, however, I would advise that we all wait for proper detailed information before starting bashing :)

 


So why the delay in getting this important information out?  Honestly, this is the worst handled roll-out of any release ever and add to that the much longer message on how MAXON is making C4D for "the world" but (by your own admission) we just haven't worked out how to handle existing customers yet.  

 

Honestly, do you find that approach acceptable?

 

Was MAXON waiting to hear how their existing customer base would react to the news before they decide on the pricing of upgrades to perpetual licenses?  If so, then I hope the message is loud and clear that we are not happy.

 

This is how I am processing this:  Given that R21 is pretty much a "meh" release, then simply let it go.  Do not upgrade...do not subscribe.  This means NO INCOME TO MAXON.  There is no compelling reason why I would need to move into R21 given that you are doing nothing to compel me to do so as a Studio owner.  The costs are the same but I either lose Cineversity or I lose a perpetual license.  The new features certainly are not a huge attraction.  So why do anything?  In the absence of any other information from MAXON, then doing nothing is in my best interests.  Here is why:

 

If there is something I need in R21 or a future release for a short project, then subscribe for 1 or 2 months only.   Again, loss of revenue to MAXON.  Wait a few years (and I mean many years) and set aside the money I would have used for an MSA and then make a decision on whether or not I buy a perpetual license of a future version at your reduced price.  Of course, if all future releases follow the Adobe model and are complete rubbish, then I have lost nothing....but MAXON has lost revenue. 

 

If the price of a perpetual license increases or you no longer offer them, then I am forced into the subscription plan --- but I wold have ended up there anyway had I continued to be a loyal supporter in all those years.    Again, no loss to me (in fact, I save a ton of money) but a loss of revenue to MAXON

 

What really makes this the most bone-headed, poorly thought out release ever is that MAXON has no information on how to handle existing customers.  All you tell us is to use the perpetual license...but based on the arguments above, it is advantageous for us NOT to jump into that model.  No matter what version you have now, costs go up or your loose service (ability to own your software or Cineversity).

 

So doing nothing is the best choice.   Is this really 3D for the whole world?  Is this really what you want?

 

Bring back the MSA with Cineversity for the perpetual license holder.  It's bad enough you are going to make me re-login every two weeks!

 

Dave

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59 minutes ago, prowl said:

UK prices are up now... 

£55.19 - monthly C4D - 1 year payment

£95.99 - month by month cancel anytime. 

£79.19 - monthly C4D with redshift - 1 year payment

£119.99 - month by month cancel anytime. 

 

Perpetual - £3300

 

Might have to change region at the bottom left to UK 

https://www.MAXON.net/en/buy/

 

But the big problem here is everyone that has a perpetual licence is now royally screwed. There is an FAQ entry which is just confusing

 

"If you own a perpetual license of Cinema 4D, you’re eligible for discounted Cinema 4D subscription pricing. You’re also able to upgrade to an R21 perpetual license. Some future Cinema 4D upgrades may be available only to subscription customers, while others may be available as perpetual licenses at upgrade pricing. Specific timing and pricing of each upgrade is not yet defined."

 

Basically they have just killed the resale value of everyones perpetual licence as there is no price for this upgrade beyond your MSA and " future Cinema 4D upgrades may be available only to subscription customers" which fragments things again!!!! FFS MAXON Cinema 4D sort it out! 

 

it's just a big kick in the nuts for anyone that has just bought it like me.

 

Aren't those before tax prices? Seems more expensive than MSA

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Just looked at the feature list - seems the subscription model and software programming to handle the licensing is what I paid for in my MSA! Yay!

 

Someone said it feels 'snappier' when asked about improvement - that old joke isn't even funny anymore. I will be curious to see the geometry of two mesh objects when I run a boolean subtract on it. Will it still create a horrible mesh? That is the real test of these 'under the hood' improvements.

 

I've been using this app forever and have held on expecting something amazing, usually there was at least one feature I liked every year - and a subscription service is NOT amazing to me. Maybe it is to management - and I think that's the problem, r21 is exciting for the MBAs and the people in accounting - they probably started dancing! The accountants got the features they wanted! The rest us us got code fixes in bevels! And an inability to own our software.

 

Sorry but the feature list is pathetic. Now I own an MSA until next year and will get r21 in September (and will also get the gift of a boatload of broken plugins for my trouble - some may never work again because the developer won't update them, or is out of business or out of the game - so I will lose some capability for my trouble). I really don't want to have to learn a new app (ie MODO) as I have so much invested in C4D - but those of us who had Studio and were paying for an MSA are getting screwed hard. The car analogy is good, being told there are improvements to my car, like not owning it anymore - and that you need to have a wifi connection to start it.

 

Accounting, management and the 3D dabbler have a win! The dabbler can now make AMAZING 3D text - just spellbinding 3D text. And I can make an intricate picture frame! Plus there are some features that allow you to make amazing spinning field patterns (stuff that no client will ever pay for) just what the masturbatory dabbler has been dreaming of. What a grand day for C4D.

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2 minutes ago, renegade said:

Just looked at the feature list - seems the subscription model and software programming to handle the licensing is what I paid for in my MSA! Yay!

 

Someone said it feels 'snappier' when asked about improvement - that old joke isn't even funny anymore. I will be curious to see the geometry of two mesh objects when I run a boolean subtract on it. Will it still create a horrible mesh? That is the real test of these 'under the hood' improvements.

 

I've been using this app forever and have held on expecting something amazing, usually there was at least one feature I liked every year - and a subscription service is NOT amazing to me. Maybe it is to management - and I think that's the problem, r21 is exciting for the MBAs and the people in accounting - they probably started dancing! The accountants got the features they wanted! The rest us us got code fixes in bevels! And an inability to own our software.

 

Sorry but the feature list is pathetic. Now I own an MSA until next year and will get r21 in September (and will also get the gift of a boatload of broken plugins for my trouble - some may never work again because the developer won't update them, or is out of business or out of the game - so I will lose some capability for my trouble). I really don't want to have to learn a new app (ie MODO) as I have so much invested in C4D - but those of us who had Studio and were paying for an MSA are getting screwed hard. The car analogy is good, being told there are improvements to my car, like not owning it anymore - and that you need to have a wifi connection to start it.

 

Accounting, management and the 3D dabbler have a win! The dabbler can now make AMAZING 3D text - just spellbinding 3D text. And I can make an intricate picture frame! Plus there are some features that allow you to make amazing spinning field patterns (stuff that no client will ever pay for) just what the masturbatory dabbler has been dreaming of. What a grand day for C4D.

LMFAO!

 

My wish is that someone prints that out, hacks into R20 to have that appear as the splash screen so that every time you start up R20 it serves as a great reminder why  people should NOT upgrade.

 

Dave

 

 

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Someone can deny this for existing users ?

 

Studio on MSA to Subscription: pay slighty more, loose perpetual license.

Studio on MSA to continue perpetual: loose Cineversity, 14 day web check, unclear price for upgrades…

Prime, Broadcast etc, get perpetual Studio R21 w 14 day web check, pay much more for next upgrades.

 

“Perpetual” now come with a caveat, it needs to phone home every 14 days.
So it is perpetual if MAXON has the server working…i remind that Autodesk just stopped serving their "perpetual" software more than 3 years old.

 

Out of this mess the only ones that seem to apparently win seem those that are new to the game that have a rent price significantly better than Max or Maya… excluding those that can have Max and Maya Indie.

 

cross posted from cgsociety.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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