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Maxon Subscribtion Plan Discussions

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19 minutes ago, everfresh said:

oh so i now don't have a moral code because i question your generalisations? do you know any of the people you were judging? yeah, i know, you don't need to, because you're a know-it-all and so full of yourself. grow up, you're way too old to be a child.

 

I am not saying anyone here is a bad person. I don't know your deeds and intentions. As for MAXON  we do know.

 

If Maxoff wanted to be make the correct moral choice they would allow some customers to subscribe and some customers to have a reasonable path to own their own software. When you don't own your own software...you don't really even own your own artwork. You've given someone else the lock and key. Adobe, Autodesk, MAXON...know this quite well. It's a powerful lever to extract money, year after year. It's coercion.

 

Big global companies love slaves.

 

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Cmon guys let's not go that route please. Its really not necessary. I would not go that far and say he is a bad person, he just have different job then us and different perspective...you can't judge it because of that. 


| MAXON Quality Assurance Specialist | 3D Asset Creatior | C4D Cafe Manager | Gamer in Heart | :compEnjoy:

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You know a tree by it's fruit, a man by his deeds. 

 

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7 minutes ago, Icecaveman said:

If Maxoff wanted to be make the correct moral choice they would allow some customers to subscribe and some customers to have a reasonable path to own their own software. When you don't own your own software...you don't really even own your own artwork. You've given someone else the lock and key.

 

there IS still the option to choose perpetual, at this point no one is forcing you to do anything. and nobody said perpetual will go away. that is your assumption. nothing more. maybe you are right and it will be the case someday, but nobody knows right now, at least none of us. so why act as if this is a sure thing? ah, yes, i know, because it was the same with adobe and your gut tells you. but that's not a valid argument. MAXON is MAXON, and adobe is adobe. 

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5 minutes ago, everfresh said:

MAXON is MAXON, and adobe is adobe. 

 

Why do you think a German company brought in an American Adobe guy to run MAXON?

 

And if perpetual licenses for coming years--with reasonable prices--are the plan, why has MAXON refused to say so?

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35 minutes ago, everfresh said:

there IS still the option to choose perpetual, at this point no one is forcing you to do anything. and nobody said perpetual will go away. that is your assumption. nothing more. maybe you are right and it will be the case someday, but nobody knows right now, at least none of us. so why act as if this is a sure thing? ah, yes, i know, because it was the same with adobe and your gut tells you. but that's not a valid argument. MAXON is MAXON, and adobe is adobe. 

 

Perpetual with periodic (every 14 days) online activation is not perpetual to me anymore. Yes, you are theoretically entitled for using the software without limitation but you completely hand over control to MAXON. There are numerous examples where 1) online activation failed or 2) older software cannot be activated anymore.

 

Another downside is that plugin developers now have to implement the new licensing too. And users have to wait again for their various plugins and render engines to be available for the new version.

 

Personally I think in 1 or 2 years the message will be like "...due to the great success with subscription, limited requests for perpetual licenses and to streamline our development we now offer only subscription, to make it easier for the user..."

 

3D for the Whole World would have been a very cheap or free Indie / Non-Commercial version, maybe with a 1080p render limitation. That could have even been a threat for Blender. Now it's the other way round and MAXON lost a huge part of its positive reputation.
 

The CEO's presentation was a failure, no drive or enthusiasm. When he mentioned something like "my favorite feature in R21... Field Force..." it seemed to me that he has never used C4D before.

 

Very silly argument that it's easier for the user now because he doesn't need to remember his serial. But now it needs a video to explain the new licensing. Easier indeed...

 

There are some nice little workflow improvements I like in R21 - Texture copy dialog options, Timeline / F-Curves optimizations, UI improvements, OpenVDB Caching, Volume rendering in ProRender and the Mixamo Control Rig is great (however is Mixamo not a proprietary and discontinued Adobe technology?)

 

But without MSA and forced online activation I will use the (MSA included) R21 for some things, but R20 will remain my main software and most likely no more upgrades, for sure no subcription.

 

I also own Redshift (purchased last year), I love it and was very exited about MAXON's acquisition but now I look at it a little bit different.

 

Another thing that bothers me is Teamrender... until now Studio offered unlimited render nodes. How is that handled with the new licensing system?

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folks, let's keep this topic civilized, it would be really bad if we had to lock it since we want everyone to express their opinion. Rest assured that this topic is being read .

 

Now, if I was still a freelancer, or a new user, I would be happy. Why? Because when I was buying a license I had to fork out full price, plus distributor fee, plus full month of waiting for box to arrive so from my personal perspective, I would embrace subscription since I could start using the software and making money right of the bat for smaller price. Everyone is leaving most valuable asset from calculation and that is time. If I am saving for perpetual license I am simply not earning with software during that saving time. Sure, my perspective is not universal and is not applicable to others but isn't it as valid? Subscription is simply a business model of today. But there are still perpetual and educational licenses

 

Now, comparisons are drawn between Adobe and MAXON. There is simply no connection there. David worked for Adobe at one point. So what? What if he worked for Microsoft, Oracle, Apple, whoever - would that make a difference? :)

 

There are many reasons to look forward to future. First of all, C4D eco system is simply cheaper to enter now, that is a fact. All logistical changes that are made with making single version, online help system, downloadable product, same buying conditions throughout the world etc will simply speed up development and free resources for more frequent release cycle. With that being said, I fully understand the concerns and specifics which people voiced here, however painting all of us that work for MAXON as bad guys is a bit too much...


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https://www.youtube.com/c4dcafe

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13 minutes ago, Hrvoje said:

painting all of us that work for MAXON as bad guys is a bit too much...

 

I said EXACTLY the opposite. I talked about some of the good MAXON employees. No one in this thread (to my knowldge) has said a bad thing about MAXON employees.

 

As for what I said about MAXON leadership...if the shoe fits...

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3 hours ago, 3D-Pangel said:

Amidst all that confusion, there have been NO posts from any MAXON employee. 

 

As you noted several pages ago, we've been busy with Siggraph. Though not dealing with upset customers - quite the contrary. The customers we spoke with at the show (both existing customers and soon-to-be-customers) are very excited about the new options that are going to offer many more folks an opportunity to join the amazing Cinema 4D community. And despite the tone of some posts here, I do still believe this is the best community around any piece of software - so many folks willing to share their techniques and their time - including the 20+ presenters that you saw on C4DLive and many others who staffed demo stations in the MAXON, Redshift, Intel, AMD and Nvidia booths. So many partners have admired both the strength of our community and the excitement over our acquisition of Redshift and our new pricing, and they're eager to play a larger role in the C4D ecosystem. My week was largely spent with them and with customers.

 

Amidst the Siggraph meetings, I've done my best to read through the various forums and other online communities and respond as much as possible (as have other MAXON team members). It hasn't been easy - often trying to parse pages and pages of comments on a phone and pecking out responses on a tiny keyboard. I'm sorry we haven't been able to be more present here and that there's been confusion. 

 

I'm back home now, and I'll do my best to answer questions.

 

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Why not have a subscribe to own option? My biggest problem is not being able to open my own files if I decide to stop with the subscription. Many other companies provide this option or something similar. Why does MAXON have to go the Adobe route. There are much more user friendly ways to achieve subscriptions.

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31 minutes ago, RBarrett said:

 

I'm back home now, and I'll do my best to answer questions.

 

 

Simple question:

Can MAXON commit long term to accommodate the user who needs a perpetual license and needs to pay less than $800 per year* in upgrades?

 

These are this customer's requirements to even consider moving forward. I'll make it easier and ask, Can MAXON make such a commitment for 3 years.

 

*In today's dollars. Of course inflation is understood.

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12 minutes ago, RBarrett said:

Amidst the Siggraph meetings, I've done my best to read through the various forums and other online communities and respond as much as possible (as have other MAXON team members). It hasn't been easy - often trying to parse pages and pages of comments on a phone and pecking out responses on a tiny keyboard. I'm sorry we haven't been able to be more present here and that there's been confusion. 

 

I'm back home now, and I'll do my best to answer questions.

 

 

The communications (or lack of) around converting from perpetual to subscription very confusing and disappointing. The prices were available for people that have never used C4D, however it seemed like nothing solid was prepared for your current users. 

 

My license is with Ireland/UK and they said they're unable to comment on costs until September. That's very disappointing to hear. Can you please communicate what way the discounts will be.

 

Will the Redshift bundle be available at discount for two years as well?

 

Many of the presentations at Siggraph were excellent and I am looking forward to R21.

 

I don't have an issue with converting to subscription if the discount makes sense to move off perpetual.

 

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