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Maxon Subscribtion Plan Discussions

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23 minutes ago, Jops said:

 

Maybe because you underestimate how much trust MAXON lost.

 

 

+1

 

A big part of what made the C4D community great was it's respect and trust for MAXON. I feel we are nothing more than a subscriber # to them now. A company that is user-focused would not implement such heavy handed policies.

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On 8/10/2019 at 4:07 PM, everfresh said:

 

eerrmm... what??? :D why would there be less people able to operate it than before? that just doesn't make any sense at all. just like most of the rest of your post. what's a mesh creation core?

I'm talking about all the new users that they plan on bringing in - that's the whole point of 'whole world' - the base is what they have now. But they don't care about the base they are trying to get 3D into the hands of everyone. I hope that is clear.

 

Ha! Mesh Creation Core™ - I was typing with any editing - I was just talking about the code that deals with creating the geometry (no clue what MAXON terms it, or how many sub areas of code there are (i'm not a programmer) - this part of the software is still unpredictable once you go beyond simple, primitive objects. Hell, dealing with it right now where fill select or phong select can't even select very defined separate geometry. Have you ever tried ring select on complex models, looks like it just selects random polygons. This is not good code.

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3 minutes ago, renegade said:

I'm talking about all the new users that they plan on bringing in - that's the whole point of 'whole world' - the base is what they have now. But they don't care about the base they are trying to get 3D into the hands of everyone. I hope that is clear.

 

Ha! Mesh Creation Core™ - I was typing with any editing - I was just talking about the code that deals with creating the geometry (no clue what MAXON terms it, or how many sub areas of code there are (i'm not a programmer) - this part of the software is still unpredictable once you go beyond simple, primitive objects. Hell, dealing with it right now where fill select or phong select can't even select very defined separate geometry. Have you ever tried ring select on complex models, looks like it just selects random polygons. This is not good code.

ring selection works perfectly if you have a properly created mesh. on messy booles or converted cad data it just can not work, it doesn't work in any other program on this earth if the mesh isn't modelled properly. it is important to know when it's ok to use bools and when not. the how is also a big factor. taking a guess i think what you're really trying to say is that you want a feature like mesh fusion in modo or hard ops addon in blender. because creating meshes in c4d works just fine, the boole object is pretty basic in its functionality, but that's just how it is for now. but using booles isn't the only way to create meshes in c4d, i recommend to try proper modelling techniques first.

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40 minutes ago, everfresh said:

i think what you're really trying to say is that you want a feature like mesh fusion in modo or hard ops addon in blender

Yes, and we do deal with CAD files a lot, and do own a copy of Modo just to deal with making better models and CAD issues (Power Translators makes a better CAD model with less polygons than C4D). Irritates me to spend on all that extra software, but then we also have PTC Creo (not a favorite) We make some frightening meshes sometimes because we deal with complex human tissue (it is also a UV nightmare). And clients have crushing deadlines that we have to deal with. Speed is critical. If I had endless time I would make pristine meshes - but time for that doesn't always exist. In the end we will cheat it and know how to make it look great (but we'd like better more intelligent software to deal with cross sections, cutaways, etc. - and yes, we do use volume builder and I won't into it's issues with texturing). Also I'm hoping for a plugin called quad remesher for r20 while this 'whole world' licensing trainwreck keeps a' tumbling along.

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40 minutes ago, renegade said:

Yes, and we do deal with CAD files a lot, and do own a copy of Modo just to deal with making better models and CAD issues (Power Translators makes a better CAD model with less polygons than C4D). Irritates me to spend on all that extra software, but then we also have PTC Creo (not a favorite) We make some frightening meshes sometimes because we deal with complex human tissue (it is also a UV nightmare). And clients have crushing deadlines that we have to deal with. Speed is critical. If I had endless time I would make pristine meshes - but time for that doesn't always exist. In the end we will cheat it and know how to make it look great (but we'd like better more intelligent software to deal with cross sections, cutaways, etc. - and yes, we do use volume builder and I won't into it's issues with texturing). Also I'm hoping for a plugin called quad remesher for r20 while this 'whole world' licensing trainwreck keeps a' tumbling along.

seen this? only windows for now unfortunately....  produces quite similar results like instant meshes, which is also available for mac, but only as an external app, not a plugin.

 

regarding cad data: what i like about c4ds cad import is that it chews through pretty much everything you feed it, but i agree, the meshes get way too heavy. that's why i still prefer to convert cad meshes with MOI, and only go the c4d route if the data is too complex and MOI won't swallow it.

 

 

 

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Who’s in ‘shock’ about Adobe again? I have a sub, as do most of the people I know socially, and the sun somehow still manages to rise each morning. I trust their output way more these days than I did a decade ago btw. The regular updates are also accompanied by regular communication, both from them and from online trainers. It frankly feels like more of a community, going somewhere together with a supporter that has your back. It wouldn’t surprise me if MAXON expand or improve on communications as well.

 

I just remembered that Unity also has a subscription plan. For the many grads who are obsessed with making games, subs are the norm, and MAXON going this route will make total sense to them.

 

I remain excited rather than apprehensive.

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if your cinema 4d version is :C4D VER: AFTER EFFECTS / C4D LITE, like stated in your profile I can understand why you are exited :)

then you are exactly the one this move is aimed at.

 

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36 minutes ago, BoganTW said:

... I have a sub, as do most of the people I know socially, and the sun ...

True. Many people have a Adobe Sub.

As Adobe was nearby a monopolist when they lured the graphical world on Cloud Nine.

Many had additional invested in Workflows based on their Software.

But most of all professional Users I know don´t like to rent.

They (have to) accept it because a change seems or is difficult, expensive or impossible.
The model is more loved by big agencies and users who do not necessarily make money from it.
And - naturaly - by the CEOs of Software Companies.

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Jops - yes, exactly. Myself and hopefully many others.

 

Raischub, I know a guy who ran a local (small) production house. Short or medium term rentals also seemed to suit him as he seemed to change his focus every other year. Most recently hit outfit went from doing corporate video, to selling 3D printed models. He never would have been happy shelling out multiple K 's for Studio only to use it for a handful of months, but I expect will see the benefits of stopping and starting licensing as he sees fit.

 

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30 minutes ago, BoganTW said:

Jops - yes, exactly. Myself and hopefully many others.

 

Raischub, I know a guy who ran a local (small) production house. Short or medium term rentals also seemed to suit him as he seemed to change his focus every other year. Most recently hit outfit went from doing corporate video, to selling 3D printed models. He never would have been happy shelling out multiple K 's for Studio only to use it for a handful of months, but I expect will see the benefits of stopping and starting licensing as he sees fit.

 

Didn´t say, there is no one.

Even when it sounds a bit strange...
Chanching business field - renting a 3D application for a few weeks (espec. printing 3D) - learning the software (some guys need years) - changing business field in the end.

But yes, why not. In this case he would be a perfect member f target group.

Subscription is OK.

As an option.

MAXON took the joice.

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I've been on the fence about coming back into the fold and renewing my MSA.  While the thought of getting R21 Studio for the price of my MSA has many perks this whole subscription nonsense has me questioning that choice. too many unknowns. Just how perpetual is perpetual; 2, 3 , 5 years? also the phone home every two weeks scheme doesn't sit well with me, what happens if I forget to fire it up for a month? I would imagine it shuts down until it contacts MAXON? is there a penalty or does it just press on like before?  I have two weeks, hopefully some more information will be forthcoming before then.

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6 hours ago, bobc4d said:

I've been on the fence about coming back into the fold and renewing my MSA.  While the thought of getting R21 Studio for the price of my MSA has many perks this whole subscription nonsense has me questioning that choice. too many unknowns. Just how perpetual is perpetual; 2, 3 , 5 years? also the phone home every two weeks scheme doesn't sit well with me, what happens if I forget to fire it up for a month? I would imagine it shuts down until it contacts MAXON? is there a penalty or does it just press on like before?  I have two weeks, hopefully some more information will be forthcoming before then.

It's your decision. I hope you appreciate your individual power and enjoy that, unsullied. You have an abundance of options if you are bold and willing to transition. (these transitions are surprisingly easy when we see the need.)

 

As for MAXON...and their policies...it's abundantly clear what they intend to do. No fuzziness really when we view as adults. They are hell bent on forcing subscriptions upon their users. "Bend over and take it".

 

They might smooth talk like politicians or drug dealers....perhaps offer "enticements".... but that's the reality. That's the new MAXON leadership.

 

Frankly, unlike Adobe which did this from market dominance, I think MAXON does this in a position of  weakness. (prime to be plucked)

 

If bending over isn't  your style...there are options. No right or wrong as a user. Do as you wish--I mean that, sincerely. And Bob...no matter what....I wish you the best.

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