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Maxon Subscribtion Plan Discussions

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On 8/28/2019 at 2:08 AM, Fastbee said:

The following quote sounds like they might do just that, but they have not figured it out officially yet.  If would make me feel better if right next to the perpetual option was a upgrade price for perpetual users of which old studio users get a lower price than other users.  I guess we have to wait.  Seems like it would be easy, but there is a ton of market analysis that goes into that one $#.

 

From RBerrett bottom of page 54 of this convo.

"MAXON will offer perpetual upgrades, as it says in the FAQ.

 

I can't give you a specific answer at this point as to when those upgrades will be offered, what they will cost or what they will be called, because as it states in the FAQ those details aren't yet fully defined. We'll have more communication on that going forward, based on development progress and customer feedback.

 

As to how long perpetual upgrades will continue to be offered - we're taking our cues from the userbase on that. You seem to assume the fact that we haven't announced an end date is a signal they're ending, but it's more clearly a signal that they'll be continuing. It means we haven't predetermined a sunset date for perpetual - or even that there will be a sunset date. We're still selling perpetual licenses - they're right there next to the subscription option. The only comments otherwise are conjecture."

I do hope that they are still trying to sort out what the cost of perpetual upgrades are going to be because what I am hearing from MAXON USA representatives is that the cost of upgrading in the future will be as if your MSA program no longer existed. 

 

For example:  Prior to 9/1/2019, the cost of an MSA was $725 and with that your got the next version.  If you did NOT have an MSA, then the cost of upgrading to the next version has been $999.   From 9/1/2019 onward, MSA's no longer exist.  Therefore the cost to get the next upgrade will be $999.

 

This has been clearly stated over and over again, so I have to assume that is the current policy that MAXON would like to stick to unless there is significant push back from the user community.   In MAXON's mind, they are thinking "Well, if you want the same price then go with subscriptions".  Subscriptions hold the user captive and free MAXON from the consequences of not releasing new features per any schedule.  If you don't like the pace of development and stop paying the subscription price, then you can't use the program.  Imagine if MAXON decided NOT to release R22 until 2021.  Subscription users are essentially paying $1440 to keep using R21 over that 2 year period.  Perpetual license holders of R21 pay only $999 over that same period.  That is an extreme example, but you get the point...subscriptions free MAXON from the financial consequences of not delivering meaningful updates on a regular basis.   Subscriptions are NOT to your advantage...they are to MAXON's advantage.  Never forget that.

 

So MAXON wants people to go to subscriptions or pay a 53% cost increase in perpetual upgrades (from $650 to $999 in less than 2 years).  Either path is an advantage to MAXON....none to the user.  No matter what type of crappy "3D for the whole world" spin you want to put on it, you need to realize that this is their agenda.  It is an agenda that Nemetschek put in motion by forcing the founders out and hiring an Adobe transplant to execute.  Disregard EVERYTHING that any corporate shill from MAXON tells you....it is greed, plain and simple.  This is a different MAXON.

 

Well, there should be consequences to treating your user base this way and that is what MAXON is going to try an gauge over the next year.  What MAXON has yet to figure out is what will every MSA user who upgraded to R21 perpetual will do when R22 comes out when faced with a $999 cost to continue being a perpetual license holder.  Yeah, Prime MSA holders are dancing in the streets over getting R21 Studio for $250 today but what they have yet to realize is that their annual costs increase 400% to $999 if they want to keep using R22 perpetual.  Even if they decide on subscriptions, that is close to a 300% increase in their annual costs (and again close to 400% if you use Redshift). 

 

So again, if MAXON is still "taking their cues from the user-base" concerning perpetual upgrades, they are in fact wondering two things:

  1. "Will we get away with a massive price increase on perpetual license sales to pretty much everyone when R22 comes out?" 
  2. "Will  everyone instead move to subscriptions which gives us all the power in deciding how to release new features?"

So despite what everyone is talking about, the line in the sand is not today (9/1/2019) but rather whenever R22 is released.  That will be the big decision point for everyone because right now life is normal...we are all under the MSA program one last time and paying what we paid in the past.  The big decision point is next year and that is why MAXON is listening to us today.  So my hope is that a 61 page thread of rage over the "new" MAXON makes them realize that the users are NOT going to take this quietly.  I hope MAXON steps out of their echo chamber and listens to our disappointment in them as a company that we trusted for decades.  I hope they feel the silent pull that Blender R2.8 is having on us as users and drop their arrogance over the purity of their new core and recognize that Blender has some pretty good features that C4D does not have...and they have them for FREE!   The new Blender interface lowers the learning curve significantly so that just makes a decision to forego a future with MAXON that much easier.  I hope MAXON takes to heart that the Blender Organization gives us something that the MAXON organization is trying to take away: Freedom from incurring significant financial consequences when deciding how we want to use the program.

 

So if MAXON is truly listening, then let your voice be heard over the next year. 

 

Dave

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I hear you Dave.

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34 minutes ago, 3DKiwi said:

I hear you Dave.

I also have one year to take this course (now on sale for $13.29 at Udemy): Blender 2.8 The complete guide from beginner to pro

35 hours of training and 4.5 stars out of 5 (313 ratings).  

 

Is everything with Blender this cheap?  It is like a whole new world (cue music from Aladdin ;-),.

 

Dave

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11 hours ago, 3D-Pangel said:

So despite what everyone is talking about, the line in the sand is not today (9/1/2019) but rather whenever R22 is released.  That will be the big decision point for everyone because right now life is normal...we are all under the MSA program one last time and paying what we paid in the past.  The big decision point is next year and that is why MAXON is listening to us today.

 

Many have already made their decision. With MAXON offering their weakest release in history, that made the choice easy. If you feel that strongly about it, giving them your money seems hypocritical.

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On 9/1/2019 at 1:53 PM, 3DKiwi said:

I hear you Dave.

me too.  I made my decision, I did not renew MSA and won't pay subscription so I am out.

edit: an ignominious ending or beginning to a once leading 3D software.

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On 8/30/2019 at 5:34 PM, hvanderwegen said:

 

That is easily resolved: select a vertex, hit the delete key, navigate to the Vertices entry, and right-mouse click that entry. Then assign your own custom shortcut key. I assigned backspace myself to quickly delete vertices.

I will try that 🙂 Thanks for sharing this.
Have you used blender for a long time? 

As for tomorrows update on C4D R21.. I decided to wait and not upgrade 😞 Even though I am using still version R18, which is stable with the tons of plugins I've bought... and at the same time, I will keep trying to use blender, since their character animation with 3D and 2D combined seems quite interesting. 

I will wait to see what people has to say about the improvements in R21, specially when it comes to character animation, and not including the whole mixamo thing...  but its core. 

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On 9/1/2019 at 7:01 AM, 3D-Pangel said:

So if MAXON is truly listening, then let your voice be heard over the next year. 

 

Dave

 

I don't care anymore what they do. It's Blender me for me now and I'm glad about that.

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Well I can download my perpetual r21 - but not that excited. Especially with broken plugins. On CGTalk they say the denoiser doesn't work well with animations (they said it causes blotchiness)- that was a feature I thought I might like. I'm trying to be interested but I guess I'm on r20 until they add something better to the mix.  Still wish they 'd get better algorithms for creating geometry (like other apps out there). I mean, it's a computer program, it is supposed to do the tedious work making clean meshes - not me. I feel just  "meh" about it all. C'mon MAXON, don't make us cheat on you.

Distracted 3D Animator.png

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Anyone heard of what special discount you get if you had a full MSA? 

I got no message from MAXON yet. Just the pay again for MSA full price.

 

PS: I don't think Blender is ready yet to replace C4D. 

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We have various options.  You can call MAXON to get the details.   

Thanks!

Dave

 

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