Jump to content

Sign in to follow this  
bbuxton

The end of MSA

Recommended Posts

Since September I have been repeatedly receiving emails from MAXON and TMSMedia trying to persuade me to give up my perpetual license in exchange for a discount on a 2 year subscription. I feel a bit stupid as the math just does not add up. Am I missing something important? I'm not trying to start a problem thread, my local reseller is Japanese and language is a barrier as my Japanese is very limited, as is their English. I have been using Cinema 4D for more than 10 years but the advantage of subscription is very hard to see.

Share this post


Link to post

There is no way I would ever give up my perpetual license that's for sure for 2-3 hundred in savings.  MAXON's treatment of long time studio customers was ridiculous, but at least they did a good job with the portal.  I am liking the ability to easily move between multiple computers and have everything there how you left it.  The way forward for me probably is to get a new subscription, which might be a long while.  Let's hope they can convince me with awesome new features and their development speeds up. I'm still dissapointed they didn't get more in R21..integration of nodes with the rest of the app, xpresso, python.  There is a serious disconnect with that stuff, but I'm relatively happy and still here.  They could have so many more customers if they had chosen more reasonable pricing... like the yearly price but paid monthly or 12 month contract would have been pretty reasonable for a lot of hobbyists I think.  The true monthly cost is just too much.

Share this post


Link to post

Thank you.

I only have one PC so am not in a position to test that.

I use quite a few plugins and R21 broke every one of them. Still trying to get XFrog and HDR Lightstudio updated and it is more than 4 months already.

Sigh, I still don't quite understand why the discount for MSA users requires perpetual entitlement to be surrendered. Seems underhand, worse than the way Adobe and Autodesk managed the transition.

 

Share this post


Link to post

It's a terrible deal in my opinion. You'd be crazy to burn your permanent license for a small, temporary discount on subscription.

You basically have 2 options:

- Buy a standard 'upgrade' to your permanent licence when R22 comes out. If, as MAXON have so far indicated, this is at the non-msa upgrade price, then you're effectively facing a 40% price increase for your upgrade compared to the now-gone MSA.

- Leave your permanent licence at R21 forever & when you feel that the cumulative updates are worth having (be that at R22, R23, whatever), get a new subscription.

Share this post


Link to post

I bought a R20 Studio license back in march 2019. Since then MAXON went with the subscription model and that is totally normal since most companies are doing that this way. When the new system was introduced we were all told not to worry as the current perpetual owners will not be left out. The months passed so I am ready to upgrade to R21 and went on the site to follow a clear procedure step by step how to get the discounted subscription. To my surprise I could not find anything as such. Maybe it is somewhere in the forums or FAQs but it must be buried deep. I remember when Avid's ProTools changed to a subscription model. I was directly informed by email on how to procede. There was also no need to surrender my old license.  I had PT for the next two years on a very generous discount. I never thought that I will list list Avid company as a role model, but here it is.

:). I can not even find an information on the amount of the discount. Another thing: since I bought a perpetual Studio R20 in March 2019, shouldn’t I be eligible for an upgrade to R21 anyways?

Piotr

Share this post


Link to post
16 hours ago, Piotr Janowski said:

I bought a R20 Studio license back in march 2019. Since then MAXON went with the subscription model and that is totally normal since most companies are doing that this way. When the new system was introduced we were all told not to worry as the current perpetual owners will not be left out. The months passed so I am ready to upgrade to R21 and went on the site to follow a clear procedure step by step how to get the discounted subscription. To my surprise I could not find anything as such. Maybe it is somewhere in the forums or FAQs but it must be buried deep. I remember when Avid's ProTools changed to a subscription model. I was directly informed by email on how to procede. There was also no need to surrender my old license.  I had PT for the next two years on a very generous discount. I never thought that I will list list Avid company as a role model, but here it is.

:). I can not even find an information on the amount of the discount. Another thing: since I bought a perpetual Studio R20 in March 2019, shouldn’t I be eligible for an upgrade to R21 anyways?

Piotr

you can't trade an r20 perpetual license for a sub. you only can trade an r21 license for a sub afaik. also i don't think you can do it via the website anyways.

also if you get r21 and then trade that perpetual license for a sub, r20 and the versions before will always belong to you, no matter what. at the time you bought r20 and versions before, there was no sub, there was a different eula, so it's not possible legally to take those perpetual licenses away from you, at least that's how i understood it.

regarding you last question: you could have gotten r21 for regular MSA price, but there was a certain grace period for it (i believe it was end of september?), so that opportunity is now gone. best to talk about it with a MAXON representative though, maybe they can do something for you.

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, everfresh said:

you can't trade an r20 perpetual license for a sub. you only can trade an r21 license for a sub afaik. also i don't think you can do it via the website anyways.

also if you get r21 and then trade that perpetual license for a sub, r20 and the versions before will always belong to you, no matter what. at the time you bought r20 and versions before, there was no sub, there was a different eula, so it's not possible legally to take those perpetual licenses away from you, at least that's how i understood it.

regarding you last question: you could have gotten r21 for regular MSA price, but there was a certain grace period for it (i believe it was end of september?), so that opportunity is now gone. best to talk about it with a MAXON representative though, maybe they can do something for you.

Please be aware that if you updated any older license to a newer version the old license became invalid.

Share this post


Link to post

I have no concrete input but I share the sentiment on this:

"I feel a bit stupid as the math just does not add up. " 
"There is no way I would ever give up my perpetual license that's for sure for 2-3 hundred in savings. "

Yea, I mean I don't get what MAXON was trying to achieve.
But when I did the math, there is no way the offered discount adds up to your perpetual license.
It's been awhile now, but it doesn't even amount to 30% of total payment for perpetual license, correct me if I'm wrong. 
It's offending. It's obscene. Especially when I bought my own personal copy just last year.  

In addition, I don't get what's the problem of just having them run side by side (i.e. continuing perpetual up to R22, R23, R24 and the subscription). 
Same way Houdini and Substance are doing. 

Anyway, thinking all about it now makes me frustrated. 

Share this post


Link to post
22 hours ago, bentraje said:

In addition, I don't get what's the problem of just having them run side by side (i.e. continuing perpetual up to R22, R23, R24 and the subscription). 
Same way Houdini and Substance are doing. 

 

I think that is what they are planing. keeping perpetual for the old not MSA update price and offering a MSA cost subscription. Well that is basically a price increase of 40%. Everyone can see it. It favors new customers over old ones (as they already invested a lot and are unlikely to quit). You can see it everywhere: New inexperienced users are flooding the forums. That is not bad and I have no objections. But when they alienate there experienced customers, they will have to educate the new customers themselves and not rely on the "fantastic comunity" who has just been taken advantage of.

Share this post


Link to post
On 1/19/2020 at 8:07 AM, everfresh said:

you can't trade an r20 perpetual license for a sub. you only can trade an r21 license for a sub afaik. also i don't think you can do it via the website anyways.

also if you get r21 and then trade that perpetual license for a sub, r20 and the versions before will always belong to you, no matter what. at the time you bought r20 and versions before, there was no sub, there was a different eula, so it's not possible legally to take those perpetual licenses away from you, at least that's how i understood it.

regarding you last question: you could have gotten r21 for regular MSA price, but there was a certain grace period for it (i believe it was end of september?), so that opportunity is now gone. best to talk about it with a MAXON representative though, maybe they can do something for you.

This is simply not the case.  If you have an older version of Cinema 4D we offer a discount onto the subscription.  There are different %'s for different older products.  It says clearly on the purchase page to call if you want a discount.  We offer discounts on any older version including C4D Lite.  It has to be the last upgraded version you own, however.

Cheers

Dave

 

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...