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Didar

Better Control over the hair?

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Hello everybody. so I have created this setup:

image.thumb.png.0e8687600a2628b6b30ad328ebaf983b.png

it seems that is a good idea for a nice tentacle. but how can we have some good controls over that? using simulation forces like Attractor can't produce a good animation. at least I could not. so what are options here? 

test.c4d

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Depending on what kind of animation your after would be the option you choose.  Simulations for some things are ok, but that's where you lose some control.  If what your aiming for is very organic then yea go simulations and cache it.  A tentacle like for a octopus would not be made from a volume builder object, your mesh will be ever changing so in the case of building a Octopus it uses well laid out topology like any character for animation.  You could use spline IK, Dynamic Ik,  Hair instancing using the force radius to aid collisions.

 

You could rig it and add a jiggle deformer for that little bit og dynamic movement while still having control.

 

 

Dan

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3 hours ago, Rectro said:

You could use spline IK, Dynamic Ik,  Hair instancing using the force radius to aid collisions.

 

Huh, I have been avoiding to use IK stuff for a long time since I should learn them. they should be easy but well a bit scary for me 😄 so I tried many other ways for that. now I probably will use Ik afterall. can you please tell me more about that hair instancing using force radius? actually I never thought of Hair instance since I am working with Arnold render and it can not render hair instances yet. are you telling me to use one object n my hair system and use force system to move it? I guess the movement should be similar to hair spline that I used and kinda unstable. oh and another question. imagine I come up with a good rig for tentacles(either ik or hair or anything), so I need to put it on the creature. I should create and skin them all together to make it good organic looking? to avoid that I used the Volume system so the connected points get melt together and it will be a good organic looking. but you are saying that is not the solution. do we have other options except create the whole creature? just to make that attached area looking good.

thanks Dan

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39 minutes ago, Didar said:

Huh, I have been avoiding to use IK stuff for a long time since I should learn them. they should be easy but well a bit scary for me 😄

IK is rather easy as long as you know a few things, a few gotchas which many have posted here, one of them being they dont add a Pole vector from the Ik settings, this essentially makes sure the joint bends in the correct direction so a knee does not bend backwards.  Along the same thought is to have a slight bend in the knee joint to start with to aid the IK in the first place.

 

46 minutes ago, Didar said:

can you please tell me more about that hair instancing using force radius? actually I never thought of Hair instance since I am working with Arnold render and it can not render hair instances yet. are you telling me to use one object n my hair system and use force system to move it?

You can add hair and use a polygon object just as a tube for tentacles and have that instanced to each hair, this is done from the generate tab from the Hair Object.  As the hair dynamics only applies dynamics to the spline, not the hair it needs to know how to deal with collisions.  When using the Generate Instance and the geometry is thicker than hair your get intersections between geometry and itself.  To deal with this a invisible forcefield is applied as a radius setting, this stops some intersections, its not perfect but it works.  Because its using geometry it will render in any engine.    You dont have to use Instancing from geometry, you can use the preset shapes in which the hair thickness setting will control its geometry.

 

54 minutes ago, Didar said:

oh and another question. imagine I come up with a good rig for tentacles(either ik or hair or anything), so I need to put it on the creature. I should create and skin them all together to make it good organic looking? to avoid that I used the Volume system so the connected points get melt together and it will be a good organic looking. but you are saying that is not the solution. do we have other options except create the whole creature? just to make that attached area looking good.

Having separate tentacles from using hair object would be on a per hair guide basis, you cant weld, or melt the tentacles and still have it work.  The hair object generates the dynamics and geometry and this the geometry remains as it is.  You would set the geometry to intersect the roots into the body of creature or plant.    Using a Spline Ik is added to a well made 3d model  with all legs e.c.t joined before the Ik rig is skinned.  Volumes are not meant to create animatable character from without the additional step of creating a new topology thats for animation purpose.  Volumes can be animated for other things but not that.  Characters need good well made models with proper edge loops in place.

 

Dan

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On 3/21/2020 at 6:24 PM, Rectro said:

IK is rather easy as long as you know a few things, a few gotchas which many have posted here, one of them being they dont add a Pole vector from the Ik settings, this essentially makes sure the joint bends in the correct direction so a knee does not bend backwards.  Along the same thought is to have a slight bend in the knee joint to start with to aid the IK in the first place.

dear Dan. what do you think about this setup? is this correct for my purpose? is this a good way of having a tentacle which can be animated properly? 

image.thumb.png.46fa8ac771f3512016ec8650e49bc441.png

Rig.c4d

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