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CApruzzese

Blender 2.8 test and impressions

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3 hours ago, Fastbee said:

First: Since it's a 2d view I can't say for certain, but I think maybe you want inner extrude or it could be exactly the way the bevel tool works.  Not sure where the problem is.

A inner extrude will join the corner vertices instead of doing a box cut.

 

3 hours ago, Fastbee said:

Second: Again that is exactly the way the bevel tool works in Blender.  Select the lines in line mode then bevel.  By default you won't have the line in the middle to dissolve away, but if you want the line up the segments in the bevel to 2.

You're right. I guess I tried so many settings in the Bevel tool for the first example to work that I didn't realized it was remembering the last settings.

 

3 hours ago, Fastbee said:

Third: There might be a better way, but the ways I came up with are as follows.  1. Edges selected then Offset Edge Slide, select and delete extra edges made on one side.  2. Bevel with profile set to 1, segments to 2, select extra edges made on one side, and dissolve.  3. Knife tool, press c for a straight cut, make cut.  Can slide after to exact position wanted.  4. With BoxCutter plugin set to knife mode the cut could be made.

That's way too many steps as a replacement for a one step operation. My workaround was to ring select the inner edges and subdivide them and the use the knife to cut the remaining ngons to quads, but there are too many steps still.

 

3 hours ago, Fastbee said:

Forth:  Again several ways to do it.  1. Without plugins and 2.83 would be to make the object, turn on sapping to Face with Align Rotation to Target on, with object made selected click on face to snap to. 

After spending a bit of a time trying to find out where the snapping toolbar is... while I was staring at it the whole time lol, I managed to snap it in the right position.

 

Cheers for the help, quite a big step for me in the right direction, but still need to find an addon to mimic the slide/clone edge because it's vital for my modelling workflow. I saw already people requesting that in the dev forum, but don't know when/if will be implemented.

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Each 3D program requires a slightly different way of approaching a topology problem, but generally one can get to the same place with about the same number of steps. In Houdini, for instance, the first example would be done with a single polyextrude (inner). The second requires a single bevel (polybevel). The third requires two nodes: a poly split and a triangulate. The fourth is done easily with creating a construction plane.  Blender has similar options, but probably one would not do this all with the bevel tool. You don't need some fancy plugin to do this sort of thing.

 

In my experience with XSI, Modo, Maya, Blender, and Houdini - the bevel tool can be quite different between programs. In Modo, the bevel tool is often used for an inner extrude. The bevel tool in C4D used to be pretty poor, but the current version makes it a bit more useful than the bevel tool in some other 3D programs. I don't think you can extrapolate that to say that C4D is overall better or worse as a modeling program than other 3D programs. If you are comfortable using the bevel tool alone for this sort of work, C4D might be your best option.

 

I would be a little careful about the example of sliding you used with C4D. It can create bad topology if you are using it with a non planar structure. In general, the bevel tool is the most apt to create triangles and ngons if not used carefully, compared with extrusions and edge loop cuts. Just to show, a simple inner extrude works fine if the structure has three dimensionality. See attachment.

Inset.jpg

Blender.jpg

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7 hours ago, Radud said:

A inner extrude will join the corner vertices instead of doing a box cut.

I kind of get it now.  Tried doing the steps in c4d and my version doesn't seem to do that or I can't figure out how to do it.  One of the two.  Since I don't know what it's doing I can't say how to do it in Blender.  Seems like it would make a lot of loose ends on the geometry though.

 

7 hours ago, Radud said:

That's way too many steps as a replacement for a one step operation. My workaround was to ring select the inner edges and subdivide them and the use the knife to cut the remaining ngons to quads, but there are too many steps still.

That was actually 4 ways to do it, but today I found the fastest way.  It's called Rip Fill and is in points mode in Blender.  Select the points, Alt+v, g to slide.  Pay attention to the side the mouse is on before doing the tool because it will determine not only which way it slides, but also if it makes new triangle on the edge of the geometry.  It is talked more about here.

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1 hour ago, Fastbee said:

That was actually 4 ways to do it, but today I found the fastest way.  It's called Rip Fill and is in points mode in Blender.  Select the points, Alt+v, g to slide.  Pay attention to the side the mouse is on before doing the tool because it will determine not only which way it slides, but also if it makes new triangle on the edge of the geometry.  It is talked more about here.

Thank you so much, this is absolutely brilliant. I have no idea why such a useful tool is hidden in the menus. Who knows what else is in there, clearly I need to read the documentation for every single tool in the modelling menus.

 

1 hour ago, Fastbee said:

Tried doing the steps in c4d and my version doesn't seem to do that or I can't figure out how to do it. 

It should work in R19 if you change the Bevel Mode to Solid and the Mitering to Default.

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3 hours ago, Radud said:

Thank you so much, this is absolutely brilliant. I have no idea why such a useful tool is hidden in the menus. Who knows what else is in there, clearly I need to read the documentation for every single tool in the modelling menus.

Seriously.  This is why I say C4D should be learned before Blender because stuff like this is so hidden in Blender no one would even know to look for it if they started with Blender.  They got some tools with 8.2+ on the left which is good, but nothing close to all of them.  Some are right click only.  Some are in the menus.  Other show up on the right if it's part of a plugin.  When a Bool is done in Blender a menu has to be gone into on the side to make one object invisible in the viewport.  It is kind of a mess.  I was thinking of doing a custom radial menu that has all the tools logically laid out.  It would make things so much easier when the keyboard shortcut is not known.

 

3 hours ago, Radud said:

It should work in R19 if you change the Bevel Mode to Solid and the Mitering to Default.

I got it working now in c4d.  I had to use a plane where I was using a cube.  With a cube it works just like Bevel in Blender.  With a plane it does something different for some odd reason. 

1981263616_bevelinc4d.thumb.jpg.ee6cca8c6960871dbb7661205f8dfcfc.jpg

The one on the bottom left is if I select the inner lines again and Bevel again.  It's such a special case where it only happens for the edge of a plane. 

 

In Blender to get this geometry on a plane it would be harder because 4 loop cuts would have to be done on the plane.  The loop cuts can be done fairly fast though.

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Blender has a lot of things hidden (and a lot that work one way if done in the viewport and another if done in the outliner). Some things (like instancing on verts) are just plain buggy. I would agree with you that C4D is much easier to learn than Blender. Personally, I think Blender is overhyped since it is free. If you want a decent alternative to C4D for modeling (non procedural), Modo would be much better to learn than Blender. Modo is not very popular except in certain niches, but it is the best modeling program on a Mac and tied with 3ds max for that honor on a PC. 

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Sorry guys but I only consider abusing Blender to find free 3d-models and use it only as exporter to Cinema 4D.

Otherwise it is much waste of time to learn many 3d-applications. Blender is good if you don´t afford to use commercial

3d-application for example in developing countries. There are amazing new Blender artists coming out from Africa for instance.

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15 hours ago, ahven said:

Sorry guys but I only consider abusing Blender to find free 3d-models and use it only as exporter to Cinema 4D.

Otherwise it is much waste of time to learn many 3d-applications. Blender is good if you don´t afford to use commercial

3d-application for example in developing countries. There are amazing new Blender artists coming out from Africa for instance.

 

That is what I thought when MAXON announced the "3D for the World!" but actually it's more like "3D rental for the 1st World", as it's still very expensive for other countries not on USD/EUR/GBP.


As for Blender, it is a very powerful software. It still lacks the simplicity and refininment of C4D, but it's superior in direct modelling and sculpting and GPU render (for example).

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