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Maxon Announces Cinema 4D R23 | Overview | Discussion


Igor

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On 9/15/2020 at 12:35 PM, MikeA said:

I think it would be good for MAXON to write a  blog post about the broad direction of Cinema's future development - because it's clear not everyone understanding what is happening...

So let's see if I understand it : ) LOL!
 

Cinema is being re-built internally - 'the new core'.

R23 Scene nodes are the first obvious visible representation of the 'new C4D'.

So currently you're seeing two systems working in parallel - 'scene nodes' (only the very beginnigs of) and the 'legacy system' - the C4D we are all used to.

The low level nodes in the 'scene nodes' manager represent some of the building blocks that are being used in the construction of the new system. That new system will give users access to the scene node editor for low level manipulation of scene elements - a more developed version of what you're seeing today in R23. In addition the familiar higher level  interfaces of the object manager (OM), interactive tools, etc will be rebuilt using the same underlying software building blocks. That tech foundation (low level nodes) can stay hidden for the majority of users who would prefer to simply use the familiar OM and interactive tools we are all used to.

 

Here's an analogy:
Think about the re-development of a major road interchange. The engineers need to keep the traffic flowing (legacy C4D) while building new roads, bridges, tunnels, flyovers etc. (new C4D). There maybe very limited use of parts of that new construction during development (scene nodes), but the old road system and new road system don't really interact with each other - they run in parallel (today's situation where scene nodes and OM don't interact). Once the new road system is more developed the traffic can fully swap from the old road system to the new and everything works 'as before - but better'. Hopefully. : )

 

 

Yes I already was suspecting a dissonance to be here as the intent was not very clear.

 

I expected scene nodes to be an attack on parametric workflows and further establishing C4D somewhere in between houdini and all the more traditional others.

 

But maybe MAXON see this more as a side benefit of simply reworking the core architecture within the new data driven structure, then maybe this is really undersold and should be made much more of a big deal imo. 

 

 

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Only commenting on the things I used. Scene nodes look promising (haven't tested), but more importantly again show a strong vision for the future. I also comment on the general outlook, MyMa

I had a surface level look at scene nodes but then digged into the past material nodes again and want to share some thoughts,  not so much about the functionality but the implications of the prio

Grateful I jumped off...and stuck w/plan for blender/R20. Will have soon saved nearly $2,000. Never had to fuss with broken plugins, bugs, hassles and modest upgrades. Already had Octane and Rizom UV.

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2 minutes ago, Shrike said:

 

Yes I already was suspecting a dissonance to be here as the intent was not very clear.

 

I expected scene nodes to be an attack on parametric workflows and further establishing C4D somewhere in between houdini and all the more traditional others.

 

But maybe MAXON see this more as a side benefit of simply reworking the core architecture within the new ECS? structure, then maybe this is really undersold and should be made much more of a big deal imo. 

 

 

I think they will make a big deal out of it when it's ready. As many have noticed and as MAXON said, right now it's just a small part of the implementation and it's pretty standalone and doesn't work with a lot of the other parts of the software.

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11 hours ago, Hrvoje said:

There will certainly be some language exposed at some point but we are still deciding what would be the best option, or options. In meantime, Nodes themselves offer huge amount of programming possibilities which are yet to be exhausted before using some language 🙂

 

While nodes may be somewhat equivalent to programming (a "visual click and connect" way so to say) one should keep in mind that even an algorithm of medium complexity will become a nightmare spaghetti of nodes and connectors when expressed through nodes. Setting up (or editing) a simple formula in e.g. XPresso takes many times longer than in plain code form, and it is less readable. Which is why I tend to insert Python nodes in XPresso, and replace whole XPresso setups by Python tags.

 

A question here would be how well Scene Nodes parallelize (which I assume they do, or you wouldn't get the visible speedup). C4D may execute nodes in parallel where a Python script could only use a single thread, the node option would naturally be faster.

 

Also, there is still programming stuff outside of the Nodes setup: plugins and scripts, and a node may be a plugin by itself. So, we will need a C++ API to program nodes, and Python for scripting (and perhaps plugins) sooner or later.

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Scene nodes make very good use of multithreading, caching and copy on write. 
in general programming in nodes is different to writing code, while one can usually be translated in to the other this is often not efficient. For nodes you need a different approach and think more about the flow of information and how it changes. If you try to directly implement a coded solution into nodes you will get bigger mess of nodes and wires than actually necessary.

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On 9/13/2020 at 4:32 PM, manufaktur said:

 

First the new license model and now no Pro Render without previous warning. I'm not very happy...

ProRender integration will return in 2021 directly update by AMD.

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💡

 

I remember old Little Brain or Crowd plug-in. And start to r&d about flow paths for crowd

 

Switch to basic shading(fast) give nice fps (~3) 😁

 

Copy polysoup from mesh of char-object with mocap data 🤩

 

test_mocap_sc.thumb.png.194b7065090252fb91752e3761c5c82e.png

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Had to register again, seems my account was removed, it's been some time I hanged out here but this will change with new version.  SUPER happy about nodes!

 

@Hrvoje

 

Aren't you the vertex pusher guy? Your nodes training is really good and should be delivered with R23

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2 minutes ago, Rapanui said:

Aren't you the vertex pusher guy? Your nodes training is really good and should be delivered with R23

Guilty and thank you very much 🙂

 

Regarding account, is it lost password? We did remove a lot of accounts that were not active for years. PM sent

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