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Hi everyone, I'm the new kid.


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Hi guys,

 

I've just joined the Cafe and wanted to say hello, give a little background info and ask a couple of newbie questions.

 

My first experience with Cinema 4D was back in 2005 as part of my multimedia design degree, I used V9 to work on some modelling projects and motion graphics assignments. The course I studied covered print, web design, illustration, 3D modelling and motion graphics but it was the 3D part that I enjoyed the most. I graduated way back in 2007 and had every intention of keeping 3D as a hobby but work and life got in the way. I've recently turned 40 and although my job is as secure as any job can be nowadays (I work in advertising/print), I'd like to challenge myself in learning 3D with the goal of eventually turning it into a career at best or just a hobby at worst.

 

The work I produced at university was fairly basic and although it's a long time ago now, I can still remember what I was taught and feel I have a good foundation to build on. I've got access to LinkedIn Learning tutorials through work and have been watching as many other free tuts online as I can.

 

My main question is regarding my version of C4D and whether I should look at taking out a monthly subscription for the latest version. I have a licence for R16 which I'm running on my iMac. I appreciate R16 is quite old now but I wanted to know if it's still a decent release for learning the basics and building my skills to a reasonable level. I'm serious about dedicating myself to learning this software and would like to know if it's necessary to be using the most recent version.

 

I want to start from the bottom up and not cut corners. At uni I threw myself in at the deep end and didn't learn the software the way I should have done due to deadlines, time restraints etc.

 

The main area I want to focus on with my 3D modelling is ArchViz. 

 

Many thanks for taking the time to read this (sorry it's quite long) and I look forward to any responses and advice.

 

All the best.

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2 hours ago, Dellphillius said:

My main question is regarding my version of C4D and whether I should look at taking out a monthly subscription for the latest version. I have a licence for R16 which I'm running on my iMac. I appreciate R16 is quite old now but I wanted to know if it's still a decent release for learning the basics and building my skills to a reasonable level.

Welcome to the cafe 🙂

 

It's a good question, and there are arguments on both sides.

 

By R16 Cinema was already a hugely powerful and refined program, and a lot of great work has been produced in it. It remains everything you need to learn the main areas of Cinema - particularly modelling, materials, Xpresso, rendering and more specialist things like Hair, bullet dynamics, cloth and sculpting. Although a lot of these things have been rewritten or adapted for the new core now  they are haven't changed a great deal in functionality so R16 would still be fine to learn these things in. R16 was also in what I would call MAXON's 'Golden Era' of maximum stability and reliability, so if you have the latest update version of that it remains a solid option.

The modelling tools (knife related ones especially) have been quite a bit different and better since R18, but they remain similar enough that if you learn the way they used to work, it won't be a massive disadvantage when you get the newer ones.

 

But on the corollary, things didn't stop getting better since R16 either. There is a now a brand new core, which means everything, including the viewport, is more future proof, powerful and efficient, MoGraph and deformers got a serious upgrade with R20 in the form of Fields and in modelling the volume builder,and overhauled Voronoi Fracture and you won't find anyone who has used these asking to go back to the way things used to be done ! Most recently MAXON sorted out UV mapping, which is now a good deal easier and less annoying than it was prior to S22.

 

So, if you are serious about this software then it follows you want access to the most powerful it can be, and the most flexibility it can offer you, then I would say yes, that tips the balance in favour of upgrading to R23 straight away. But if you are short on cash, or it would be a struggle to afford it right now, then there is no harm to your learnings if you did 6 months with R16 first.

 

CBR

 

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28 minutes ago, Cerbera said:

Welcome to the cafe 🙂

 

It's a good question, and there are arguments on both sides.

 

By R16 Cinema was already a hugely powerful and refined program, and a lot of great work has been produced in it. It remains everything you need to learn the main areas of Cinema - particularly modelling, materials, Xpresso, rendering and more specialist things like Hair, bullet dynamics, cloth and sculpting. Although a lot of these things have been rewritten or adapted for the new core now  they are haven't changed a great deal in functionality so R16 would still be fine to learn these things in. R16 was also in what I would call MAXON's 'Golden Era' of maximum stability and reliability, so if you have the latest update version of that it remains a solid option.

The modelling tools (knife related ones especially) have been quite a bit different and better since R18, but they remain similar enough that if you learn the way they used to work, it won't be a massive disadvantage when you get the newer ones.

 

But on the corollary, things didn't stop getting better since R16 either. There is a now a brand new core, which means everything, including the viewport, is more future proof, powerful and efficient, MoGraph and deformers got a serious upgrade with R20 in the form of Fields and in modelling the volume builder,and overhauled Voronoi Fracture and you won't find anyone who has used these asking to go back to the way things used to be done ! Most recently MAXON sorted out UV mapping, which is now a good deal easier and less annoying than it was prior to S22.

 

So, if you are serious about this software then it follows you want access to the most powerful it can be, and the most flexibility it can offer you, then I would say yes, that tips the balance in favour of upgrading to R23 straight away. But if you are short on cash, or it would be a struggle to afford it right now, then there is no harm to your learnings if you did 6 months with R16 first.

 

CBR

 

 

 

Many thanks for your detailed response, I really appreciate it.

 

I've had every intention of learning this software for several years now but have unfortunately been a bit stop/start due to various reasons and excuses. Working all day in my full time job meant the last thing I wanted to do when I got home was sit in front of the computer again but due to recent circumstances and reaching a milestone birthday, I've had a bit of a kick up the backside and have rediscovered the motivation I had at university. I've been working from home since March last year due to the pandemic, which has had it's advantages as I'm able to watch Cinema 4D tutorials during breaks and whenever I have a free moment. Something which wasn't possible back in the office.

 

I've been looking at the prices for C4D and while it's quite expensive I do prefer a subscription model to forking out thousands of pounds outright for the software. As I mentioned I'm a complete beginner and want to learn this program from the bottom up (not cut corners as I did 15 years ago). I can remember everything I was taught before so it will come in handy but I clearly would have missed a lot as I was working to project deadlines and only learning what I needed to complete each task.

 

I want to walk before I can run and if the first 6 months to a year of my learning are going to be mastering the basics of modelling then if the toolset hasn't changed that much from R16 then maybe it might be better waiting. I want to focus on modelling, texturing and lighting with the plan to build a portfolio of architectural visualisation scenes. I'm not interested in animation, character modelling or anything like that. If I can start to produce work to a reasonable standard using the version I have then I can look at upgrading in the future.

 

Thanks for your advice and time.

 

 

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Welcome!

I agree as well you would do fine with getting your first steps with R16.

And once you managed the software you can then have a better understanding of what you might be missing in R16.

Maybe nothing at all, maybe a little here and there.

You might then also consider to purchase a second hand version of ... let's say R19 or R20. Unless you really need (or want) the features available in later version(s).

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3 hours ago, dast said:

Welcome!

I agree as well you would do fine with getting your first steps with R16.

And once you managed the software you can then have a better understanding of what you might be missing in R16.

Maybe nothing at all, maybe a little here and there.

You might then also consider to purchase a second hand version of ... let's say R19 or R20. Unless you really need (or want) the features available in later version(s).

 

Thanks for your comment, I think sticking with what I have in R16 will be the best option for the first year while I get to grips with it. I'll be learning part time so it's going to take me a while to achieve the basics. I don't think I'll be requiring any of the newer tools and features for a long time yet! 

 

Cheers

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10 hours ago, Dellphillius said:

 

Thanks for your comment, I think sticking with what I have in R16 will be the best option for the first year while I get to grips with it. I'll be learning part time so it's going to take me a while to achieve the basics. I don't think I'll be requiring any of the newer tools and features for a long time yet! 

 

Cheers

Welcome to the Cafe.....IMHO it is the friendliest, most helpful  community on the internet. 

 

Always a smart choice....use what you have until you outgrow what you have.

 

Now the question is what do you want to do with C4D?  If it is modeling, I think Cerbera made an excellent case for sticking with R16.  While there have been some very good improvements since then (when was the polygon pen introduced?), R16 should suit you just find. 

 

If it is Mograph, then R16 will still be a good choice, but you are missing a whole realm of possibilities with fields introduced in R20.

 

Do you want to sculpt?  Not sure if that was introduced in R16 or R18.  I think it was R18.

 

Ultimately, your modeling skills will grow to a point where you want to improve your texturing skills.  Well...the standard for material controls these days is with nodes and they were introduced in R20.

 

So what do you want to make today?

 

Dave

 

 

Sorry...but I simply do not have enough faith to be an atheist.

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3 hours ago, 3D-Pangel said:

when was the polygon pen introduced?

 

 R17. I'd forgotten about that. That is a serious upgrade you'd be missing with R16, although it is really a combination of about 10 other tools you do have separately...

 

Sculpting was new in with R14 as I recall, so he has got that, but not the much needed improvements to it that arrived in R17+

 

CBR

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, 3D-Pangel said:

Welcome to the Cafe.....IMHO it is the friendliest, most helpful  community on the internet. 

 

Always a smart choice....use what you have until you outgrow what you have.

 

Now the question is what do you want to do with C4D?  If it is modeling, I think Cerbera made an excellent case for sticking with R16.  While there have been some very good improvements since then (when was the polygon pen introduced?), R16 should suit you just find. 

 

If it is Mograph, then R16 will still be a good choice, but you are missing a whole realm of possibilities with fields introduced in R20.

 

Do you want to sculpt?  Not sure if that was introduced in R16 or R18.  I think it was R18.

 

Ultimately, your modeling skills will grow to a point where you want to improve your texturing skills.  Well...the standard for material controls these days is with nodes and they were introduced in R20.

 

So what do you want to make today?

 

Dave

 

 

 

Hi Dave,

 

Thanks for your response, from my short time here, I agree, it's certainly a friendly forum!

 

I'm looking at getting to grips with modelling before I move onto my other targets of texturing and lighting. My previous experience with C4D was just nurbs modelling so I'd like to try and master polygon modelling. The polygon pen sounds interesting, I'll research that.

 

How easy is it to buy an older licence of R20 instead of going with the latest release? 

 

Cheers

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