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Mezus

Vray For C4D

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If photorealism is the key aspect in your work, then you try Maxwell, and there is demo available. If speed is imperative, Vray has the edge over both.

I am not a Vray user, but I suspect you have to feel at home with AR first, or similar, easier engine to be able to use Vray efficiently, or at least have some overall experience with biased render engines.

Cheers


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Guest Biagio

If photorealism is the key aspect in your work, then you try Maxwell, and there is demo available. If speed is imperative, Vray has the edge over both.

Just curious -- I understand that part of what makes Vray more photoreal than AR3 is it's BRDF materials. Is it that Maxwell just takes the physical properties even further?

One last thing -- I assume that there's not a "BRDF" shader or plugin you could get for Cinema 4d -- I'm guessing that's what Vray is for?

New to the boards here, and just want to say "Thanks" for all the quick responses. Learning a lot reading through the posts here.

Best,

Biagio

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In my opinion, it doesn't matter how fancy something is named, and that goes for BRDF's, BSDF's, ZBNFSKLMNS etc or other naming conventions for technologies built into product :)

What is important, is to know what to expect from each render engine. You can get top quality renders from every engine, assuming you know what you are doing. To simplify, any of these engines will do the job, but depending on their strong sides, they will show advantage over other in certain situations. My best advice for new users would be - don't go for a third party render engine unless you know exactly why you need one.

Cheers


Free C4D trainings from MAXON professional on our youtube channel

 

https://www.youtube.com/c4dcafe

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Guest Biagio

To simplify, any of these engines will do the job,

Well put, and that puts it to bed for me for now. Thanks again and have a great weekend.

Biagio

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If the goal is 'photo-realism' then Vray's material system is much better suited than Cinema's native materials.

What Vray does is to allow the user a deeper, more tightly integrated environment within which to simulate real-world surfaces, if that is your aim. One of the most obvious differences is in the level of control Vray offers over specular shading - an area in which I think Cinema is very weak. The attached image shows the Vray material attributes for a single specular layer, and you can have up to five of these in a single material.

Mark

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Guest Biagio

One of the most obvious differences is in the level of control Vray offers over specular shading - an area in which I think Cinema is very weak

Good point, and thank you for the screen shot.

Just in the spirit of the "indy" mindset, say someone wanted to improve their specular shading in C4D with it's current tools -- any thoughts on how some layering trickery or other work-arounds might help someone make their specular shading more real?

Thanks again,

Biagio

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Guest Biagio

R13 phyrender is excellent renderer fully capable off producing quality renders

I run a Mac and mainly use C4D for modeling and texturing for Architecture

To both of these points/thoughts, just had a lot of fun looking at A versus B at AM scenes: http://amscenes.com/

What's great is that every scene is both Vray and AR3 ready, with rendered pics. It was the first time I was able to see a huge number of AR3 versus Vray renders all in one place, both interior and exterior.

After spending a good 30 minutes A/Bing through most of them, it's clear that Vray has an edge in most of the renders, but AR3 seems darn close, and I do think you could "match" a lot (not all) of the differences in with cheats in compositing.

There's also a freebie scene there of a bathroom to download an play with, FYI.

As a side note, looks like those were all rendered in C4D 11, so one would think with linear workflow AR3 would look even closer.

Hope you find this useful.

Best,

Biagio

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With R13 AR has completely new physical render engine which is as capable as Vray or any other engine ;)

Cheers


Free C4D trainings from MAXON professional on our youtube channel

 

https://www.youtube.com/c4dcafe

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Just in the spirit of the "indy" mindset, say someone wanted to improve their specular shading in C4D with it's current tools -- any thoughts on how some layering trickery or other work-arounds might help someone make their specular shading more real?

Thanks again,

Biagio

Not really. Cinema only allows additive layering (mixing) of a limited set of channels and Specularity is not one of them. There is a bit more flexibility in the reflection channel in a C4D material so you might be able to get a bit more creative with that.

This weakness is one of the reasons for the existence of some of the SLA shaders, but they have their own limitations - and they're, what, fifteen years old, maybe more.

edit: I guess you could duplicate a material, vary the specularity and then blend using alpha, but I suspect that might take a fair bit of experimentation, and it may affect other channels in ways that are undesirable.

Mark

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With R13 AR has completely new physical render engine which is as capable as Vray or any other engine ;) Cheers

How would you support that statement? - you've already said earlier in the thread that you don't use Vray and can't say anything about it, and your review of the Maxwell plugin comes to a rather different conclusion.

Mark

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SImple. There is absolutely no reason or limitation within AR at this moment that would make it less capable render engine than Vray or Maxwell. Sure, before R13 there was no real dof, SSS sucked, but It is not like it is missing some very important feature now? The fact is, it is very powerful and capable, just as any engine in right hands.

I don't use Vray, but I know from some gigs it has it's own "downsides", just as any other renderer. To simplify, If one can't get the image he wants from either of those 3, it is due to unexperienced user, not the renderer itself.

I am not sure what you mean when you say that my review comes to a different conclusion? :)

Cheers


Free C4D trainings from MAXON professional on our youtube channel

 

https://www.youtube.com/c4dcafe

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To both of these points/thoughts, just had a lot of fun looking at A versus B at AM scenes: http://amscenes.com/

What's great is that every scene is both Vray and AR3 ready, with rendered pics. It was the first time I was able to see a huge number of AR3 versus Vray renders all in one place, both interior and exterior.

After spending a good 30 minutes A/Bing through most of them, it's clear that Vray has an edge in most of the renders, but AR3 seems darn close, and I do think you could "match" a lot (not all) of the differences in with cheats in compositing.

There's also a freebie scene there of a bathroom to download an play with, FYI.

As a side note, looks like those were all rendered in C4D 11, so one would think with linear workflow AR3 would look even closer.

Hope you find this useful.

Best,

Biagio

I agree, the biggest difference is render times, which can be several hours. The decision really is: does the time savings of VRayForC4D justify the extra expense for your particular business. If you download and render the AR3 and VRay project files from that link you can see the time differences for yourself.

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