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Guest Scottishcpt

Maxwell Or V-Ray?

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Guest Scottishcpt
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  • I was just wondering on what your guys' thoughts were on these two renders.

     

    Cinema 4D's built in renderers do everything I want for things up to "mostly photorealistic". Occasionally, I've got something I want to render as accurately as possible without spending an ungodly amount of time trying to correct and patch things up in post, and for this I'd like to buy into a more powerful renderer with a more flexible and physically accurate material system.

     

    I have narrowed down my choices to Maxwell Render, and of course V-Ray.

     

    Maxwell seems moderately interesting in that while it is extremely slow to render, things like multi-light and the ability to directly apply real world photography and lighting knowledge to your scene setup would appear to actually make it quicker to use in some situations. From my time spent with the demo, they're definitely not joking when they say that light in that thing basically behaves the way you'd expect it to in real life.

     

    Then there's V-Ray. I keep coming back to this renderer, but I'm always scared off by the plugin. Even with version 1.8 out, from what I've seen from the screenshots they didn't bother to proof read the GUI strings at all (I know this doesn't matter in the long run) and that makes a pretty bad first impression. Nonetheless, V-Ray is V-Ray. The core is the same and I'm told that a lot of concepts from 3DS Max and Maya transfer over to the C4D version almost directly, so that's kinda nice for tutorials and stuff.

     

    All I'm after here is photorealism. Render times don't entirely matter to me (and they matter even less with Maxwell, since you can pause the render or flat out stop it and resume later on). I'd rather deal with a longer render time and less post work because then at least I can work on something else while the render is busy cooking in the background.

     

    -SC

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    IMHO, Maxwell is easier to setup because you have less parameters to worry about both in the  Render Settings and Materials. Other than that, it's just a matter of hitting Render and come back after a few days  :lol:

    VRAYForC4D is more complex to setup (but once knowing your way around it, this matters less and less) but it renders faster and supports more C4D features than Maxwell. Version 1.8.1 is still buggy, though. I don't own it myself but worked with it previously. I'm waiting to see if a certain project will come my way and then I'll buy a license because speed matters to me and I like the type of control Vray materials have. One thing that worries me about it is the company who's developing it, takes too long to implement new features, probably due to it's small size.

     

    With R15, the Physical Render is better and to me is giving results closer to those of Vray, it's not quite there yet but closer and closer.

     

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    Version 1.8.1 is still buggy, though.

     

    Such as?

     

    K

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    Go to their forum and read respective thread.

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    I ask because I use it daily to churn out stills and animations for clients and there's nothing in particular that I find myself banging my head against. When you describe it as "still buggy" that gives the impression that there are some serious shortcomings.

     

    K

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    Well, I guess it depends on the type of project you're on! 

    Did you tried DR without any issues? If so did you test how long it takes to render a scene with and without the AdvBitmap shader? 

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    What's DR?

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    Distributed Rendering!

    You can use up to 10 machines (render nodes) with a single license. ATM it can't use Team Render. Apparently you can only use DR if you load your textures to the respective material channels using that bitmap loader shader that gives you more control (true) but it doubles+ the render time.

     

     

    There are many new shaders available via the vray shader in the shaders menu, we recommend for highest quality, that for using bitmap textures always to use the "VrayAdvBitmap" shader.it is a power bitmap shader, already including color correction controls, and the image quality is higher than with the internal c4d bitmap loader. also it loads hdri images correct from beginning. in addition if you always use this shader for bitmaps you are already ready for using it in V-Ray DR.

    Also scenes are taking a bit to load with 1.8. and apparently some files are misplaced and needs to be put manually in the proper places.

    It's normal after an update such as this to experience bugs and such. I'd just put it on hold for a bit before using it on complex projects.

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    Of course. No, don't use that. I renderfarm everything. Clients pay for it so there's no point in sweating over renders.

     

    I've not noticed scenes taking any longer to load and, so far at least, not had any wandering texture, though that was something of an issue at some point in the past.

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    Of course. No, don't use that. I renderfarm everything.

     

    Are you saying you're able to render across multiple machines with 1.8.1 without using Vray's Distributed Rendering?  How are the machines configured?  Last I heard, 1.8.x wasn't working with non-DR distribution methods (even for distribution-by-frame) in C4D.  I'd be very interested in how you got it working?

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    All I'm after here is photorealism. Render times don't entirely matter to me (and they matter even less with Maxwell, since you can pause the render or flat out stop it and resume later on). I'd rather deal with a longer render time and less post work because then at least I can work on something else while the render is busy cooking in the background.

     

    This almost precisely describes the scenarios where I use Maxwell today.  I've got Vray as well, because sometimes I'm in situations where render times do matter, and that's where Vray really shines, but if I set aside that render time prioritization I'd likely use Maxwell for most things.  Its accuracy is unmatched, and you're literally working with light just as you would taking pictures.  For exclusively photoreal needs, where render time isnt a priority, I'd recommend Maxwell without hesitation.  As an added bonus, if you work in multiple 3D pkgs, Maxwell licenses offer cross-package support.

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    Are you saying you're able to render across multiple machines with 1.8.1 without using Vray's Distributed Rendering?  How are the machines configured?  Last I heard, 1.8.x wasn't working with non-DR distribution methods (even for distribution-by-frame) in C4D.  I'd be very interested in how you got it working?

     

    No, as I said, I renderfarm. And by that I mean something like Rebus.

     

    Having said that, when I do utilise more than one machine here in the studio I don't bother distributing the render, I simply give each machine its own shot to render. Everything gets rendered shot by shot and then assembled in post anyway, even when going to the farm, so it's never going to be an issue. In fact, this would explain why I've never come across this.

     

    And a note about post: If you're striving for the upper reaches of excellence then it doesn't matter what render engine you're using, you're going to have to do a whole lot of 'post'. You can't expect a render to simply drop straight out of the render engine and rival the best of photography which will, inevitable, have a ton of post work to get it to where it is.

     

    As for the supposed superiority of Maxwell when it comes to photorealism. I think a lot of people are falling for the marketing. The simple fact is, there are any number of render engines out the from which you can find images that rival anything you can get out of Maxwell. You just have to do an image search and the proof is right there, no matter what the official line is. There are plenty of other render engines (of which Vray is only one) that can turn out renders indistinguishable from photographs.

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