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arail

so what happens to the cafe when Nigel dumps c4d?

171 posts in this topic

Quoting 3DKiwi on the modo forum:

Re upgrade price. As a Cinema 4D user who has tinkered with Modo on and off over the years and now made the decision to dump Cinema 4D I can tell you that Cinema 4D users would love to be paying $495 or $499 and get the big enhancements that 901 has. Cinema 4D Studio users pay US $650 for a yearly maintenance contract (MSA) which includes an upgrade. Actual upgrade pricing is a bit more. That $650 then gets you a random selection of enhancements and with key areas of the application left to stagnate e.g. UV editing.

So looking forward to getting into Modo properly this time around. Before I was mainly using C4D and tinkering with Modo. Not possible to be properly proficient in 2 3D applications. I did in fact sell my 601 license so that I could focus on C4D. I've now bought 801 from a US reseller for a good price and with a free upgrade to 901. This time around I'm here to stay :)

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He will maintain cafe to teach us Modo as make us transition. I am sure considering this. :)

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I was wondering if someone would notice this. I did think about whether I should post or not. I'm not too bothered the cat's out of the hat as it was going to come out soon anyway.

To answer the question: Hopefully someone will take over running the cafe. I'm talking to someone now about it. When I've got something to announce I'll announce it properly here at the cafe. Yes I am moving on both from using C4D and also from running the cafe.

Shouldn't come as any surprise to people that I'm dumping C4D. I've been increasingly critical / frustrated with Maxon this year in the forums. I no longer have the confidence in Maxon that I did after the R15 and R16 releases where I thought that they were finally getting their act together. Now I don't. I can only bang my head against a brick wall for so long. The Modo 901 upgrade is an absolute killer upgrade and for a hobbyist modeller like me. Modo is a much better fit than C4D is. Luxology / The Foundary also interact with their customers, something Maxon just doesn't get.

I am no longer a Beta tester. I obviously can't comment on what's in R17 because of the NDA.

Running the cafe has been a blast but the time has come for me to move on. I'm also a lot more into my cycling now. I want less responsibility than what I've had for the last 11 years running the cafe.

Regards

Nigel Doyle / 3DKiwi

Edited by 3DKiwi
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Of course c4dcafe could become ... modocafe.

It's worth pointing out that one of the real big weak points in the modoverse is tutorials, especially tool specific tutorials - which you're a genius at.

In an ideal world MAXON would step up to the plate and buy the cafe from you and become an active participant in the c4d world.

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And, I think anyone who can add one comment to another can surmise that there are no improvements to Body Paint in 17. Add these together - Nigel was a beta tester + Nigel hoped for an improved Body Paint + Nigel's moving to modoland (with a Screw This! comment thrown over his shoulder going out the door) = no improvement in Body Paint.

Edited by arail

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One thing that I honestly don't understand is why MAXON doesn't have a forum on their own! It's sad to watch  Nigel going away and that really makes me wonder what if R17 will bring anything new or even what we've been asking for years! One thing is for sure: I sold my 601 license in order to buy a C4D Studio license but I'm seriously thinking about including Modo back into my pipeline!

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Wow Nigel, it's like a mini earthquake in the C4D community, I hope shockwave will spread until Germany. It's sad but I totally understand you, as a beta tester and the owner of this forum it shouldn't be easy to stay neutral everyday when you see the direction C4D is taking since several releases as well as the MAXON "poor" policy, we can all feel your frustration. I'm also seriously considering to bring Modo to my toolset until the day the Foundry will bring a viable alternative to Mograph to completely switch, honestly at the rate things are going it could happen even before C4D has a proper symmetry tool.

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I hope everything ends well; MODO 901 is looking very good and MAXON doesn't seems to be listening at their Big community.

PS. I love the new look of the Cafe.

 

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So what was the point of this huge site software change if you are leaving and dropping C4D??

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I write this post as a PUSH BACK against the wave of sentiment here.

Yes I too have felt growing disillusionment and even some antipathy with MAXON:
-Bugginess and brokenness has pervaded recent releases--particularly with new features
-A lack of upgrades have been issued where they are needed most
-MAXON has been a complete corporate jackass in refusing to communicate with customers.

Now, Kiwi, a stalwart of the community announces he's leaving the island.

However....However... I do owe it to myself to be mindful of a few things:
Each user has different objectives and areas of focus in 3d. For me motion graphics is the #1 priority.

So before I follow Nigel--who has always seemed primarily interested in modeling above all................or am overly swayed by Brian--whose primary interest is gaming/rigging/character work.....

I best think about why I chose c4d in the first place. I best wait to make up my own opinions about R17's feature set and how it impacts my own goals.

I will be buying the Modo upgrade. I will be making a more concerted effort to learn it.

But my ongoing relationship to c4d is too important for impulsivity or thoughtfulness.

I have a vast investment of time, study, usage with c4d. I have a lot of plugins and files and resources. In the longterm I won't be held hostage to MAXON because of this investment. But I need to avoid being rash!

Edited by IceCaveMan

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I've known this discussion was coming for a while but it's still a little sad for me to see it. That's a selfish reaction though really because I guess part of me wants things to stay how they are. Change is hard but often it leads to better things in the long run. I totally understand Nigels' decision to leave the beta (I did the same myself after 2 years on it) and to stop running the cafe. If you invest a lot of time in something it has to be something you are very passionate about, otherwise what's the point?

I'll always appreciate that when I first started looking into this crazy world of 3D I found this site and Nigels' tutorials which in a calm and reasonable voice explained things that were a complete mystery to me as a beginner. I remember when Nigel remarked a couple of years later in a private conversation 'I wonder could you make a living it this?' I took it as a vote of confidence that someone I consider a great teacher of 3D thought I might manage that. And he was right, these days I do make my living from 3D and I love it. So I have a lot to thank Nigel for.

Regarding MAXON/C4D in general and the sentiment here, I have my opinions that's obvious to most I'm sure. Part of why I left the beta was so that I could express them without appearing disloyal to MAXON. I prefer to be a paid customer and voice my criticisms and concerns as one, I feel it puts me on even footing with anyone else who pays their fees each year.
I have however no plans myself to stop using C4D any time soon. To be blunt, I make money using C4D and Maya as as long as that's true I'll keep forking out for the MSA for C4D and my Maya subscription. If it gets to a point where I'm not making a reasonable return on that investment each year then I'll ditch the one that's not making me money. In the meantime I've very much open for business for all C4D users that need high quality character work and will remain so as long as there's a demand for that.

 

Back to Nigel and the Cafe, I commend him for all of his hard work over the years steering this ship with enthusiasm and always in a fair and reasonable way and wish him the best of luck for his new adventures with Modo. The Modo community I'm sure will benefit from that and more power to him and them.

:thumbsup:

Cheers,

Brian

 

 

Edited by Horganovski

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I want to echo Brian's sentiments to Nigel. I am a relative old timer at C4D Cafe and I would not have upgraded from C4D 6 had I not found good tutorials at the cafe which were scarce in those days. 

Cinema 4D has definitely lost some luster over the years but I love the procedural aspects of it with NURBS and Mograph. I still like C4D over Modo with the exception of its material workflow and renderer. The thing that keeps me from going Modo full tilt is the navigation and its lack of a procedural workflow(once you drop a tool that is it)

 

Rob

Edited by coolcajun

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