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CApruzzese

Xparticles 4 release date

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Cutman    137
14 hours ago, daveo said:

We will be showing XP4 at IBC, the current teaser is for newsletter subscribers. Full information, images, videos and sneak peaks will be along from October onwards. This is our biggest XP release, it has been a major development investment.

Dave I hope you've got some killer news about GPU acceleration in XP4 and maybe even a nodal interface for XP4?

 

Without XP I would no longer be a Cinema4D user in fact XP has effectively become C4D for me. I nearly always first turn to the XParticles menu to start a mograph project. In the many years of MAXON dilly dallying over performance improvements XP really has been the go to tools for me and if MAXON ever deliver a C4D with better object handling XP will be in prime position to exploit that performance.

 

Have an excellent IBC and I hope you won't be too shy in publishing demos for those of use who can't make it there. You sold me on the cloth solver because I've turned down cloth work on more than one occasion due to the state of the native cloth tools but this update looks massive and I absolutely cannot wait to get my hands on it.

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3D-Pangel    177

My point was not that apart from the features themselves which always get the most praise, the architectural design to integrate everything together also deserves some praise. Also, I am pretty sure that they considered offering many different licenses of XP.   Trust me.....these guys make smart moves and my comments are not going to be a revelation to them.  But they chose not to for the reasons you mentioned.

 

I wonder if with the inclusion of Xplosia that they will continue to allow integration with TFD.  I agree with CApruzzese in that the gaseous sim capability in XP 3.5 was a bit difficult to work with and that you could get much better results much faster and easier with TFD.  I would imagine that  Insydium knew that, otherwise why purchase Xplosia....well that is my hope.

 

Dave

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Cutman    137

Heads up.

Xparticles4 sneak peek by Mario Tran Phuc at IBC on C4DLive.com on Sunday 1.00pm and 10.00pm CEST.

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Zmotive    49

Thanks for posting that. [Edit: I saw the announcement graphic now... looks like tomorrow 1pm is a demo of the total ecosystem (XP 3.5 and Cycles4D probably) and Sunday is the Sneak Peek like you're saying). Damn! lol was hoping for some lunchbreak fun today. Sunday will be here soon enough. Could wake up early to catch the stream. How quickly after a stream does the archive go up on C4DLive.com?]

 

BTW to your earlier comments:

 

1) I don't see a strong benefit to making XP nodal given that their hierarchical system of objects is already intuitive, and that the materials can be handled nodally in Cycles4D. Either way you could end up with a pretty complex tree of objects. If they did add "nodality" I would hope it to be an option and not forced as I could see times where I'd want to use one or the other.

 

2) GPU-wise I'm not sure if the better thing would be to optimize the plugin for GPU or further accelerate Cycles4D as the previewing mechanism. But seems like we can't lose there, as at a minimum the Blender group is doing regular OpenCL updates to Cycles. I'm sure Insydium does further optimization work on top of that.

 

In general I'm not sure if the "roadblock" as far as what you see in the C4D viewport is the usual object management thing MAXON has to address or if Insydium could circumvent it in some way by further optimizing XP. Probably not and I think that's part of the reason why they came up with Cycles4D. But that's all conjecture on my part. One things's certain: with these kinds of new capability, a lot of processing power is likely to be a must even if not strictly required to operate.

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Cutman    137

1. A complex question/answer XP system can be a bloody nightmare to debug even if you're very careful about naming etc. A nodal scene graph would be much easier to track the associations IMHO. I don't think it would be a case of one or the other so those who prefer to put a rig together with nodes can and others could carry on as usual. I prefer nodal programming, it clicks for me.

 

2. If you're dealing with a lot of particle dynamic, collisions and constraints the simulation can crawl. You can't just reduce the number of particles as this completely changes the dynamics calculation so you need to be calculating with the final amount of particles. My understanding is that this sort of thing is still better done on the GPU than CPU as they're relatively simple calculations that many GPU cores can burn through.

 

XP runs in its own world as far as possible but has to use C4D's drawing routines and whenever it comes into contact with the host it hits the object handling roadblock. Another example is if you've ever tried to use XPresso with XP you immediately kill performance because XPresso is a massive roadblock.

 

The C4DLive stream has been dreadful, it was OK early on but was down from about lunchtime and I gave up.

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Zmotive    49

Yeah I know exactly what you're talking about WRT to particle dynamic / collision slow-downs but prior I had attributed that much less to XP than the combination of Mac pain and C4D object management pain. Probably a mix but most of the work for alleviating that lies with MAXON. Cycles4D can definitely be of help in some areas though in terms of rapidly previewing a single frame at a reasonable quality. Still learning how to optimize settings in that respect.

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nerv    228

I won't mind a nodal system as long as XP remains simple and approachable.  That's the whole reason I ditched Houdini for XP.  

 

GPU acceleration (just like TFD, Realflow, etc.) would be a huge feature. I don't think optimizing Cycles to preview simulations is much of an advantage.  You still need to be able to cache your sims within a reasonable amount of time.  Also, not everyone wants to be forced into the XP-Cycles ecosystem.  As much as I believe that Cycles is fantastic for XP, I still want the freedom to choose another render engine if it suits my particular project's needs better.  

 

 

 

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Zmotive    49

Fair point re: Cycles4D and not everyone using it. In that light any GPU optimization for XP would be a welcome thing, but I remain uncertain as to whether XP is the actual bottleneck in the C4D environment (leaving Cycles4D out of the picture).

 

Agree with your comment about approachability. Hard to imagine any nodal system being more approachable than the way it's set up now, though for some situations it would be useful. My main thought there is that it has to remain an option, as noted earlier. Also I think pouring programmer-hours into continued refinement of the simulation technology would provide a far bigger payoff in most situations, than pouring those same hours into node-ifying XP. That said it's clearly a trend in the industry and some people swear by it.

 

I guess they'd have to formally survey their use base to know the right answer.

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Greatszalam    72

They haven't even mentioned any of the updates to the regular particle system that I saw at NAB (other than the FlowFields which looked AMAZING, by the way). You guys/girls, this is a huge, huge update!

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Cutman    137
15 hours ago, Greatszalam said:

They haven't even mentioned any of the updates to the regular particle system that I saw at NAB (other than the FlowFields which looked AMAZING, by the way). You guys/girls, this is a huge, huge update!

Was there any GPU acceleration in the demo you saw?

 

Spill the beans!

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grain    102

Mario is speaking right NOW on c4d live but haven't seen any v4 craziness thus far. 

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Greatszalam    72

@grain XP4 stuff is tomorrow.

 

@Cutman, I don't remember seeing any GPU stuff. It was just additional tools that they showed. The stuff I'm most excited about is the stuff they put in the newsletter. Better gas/fluids, better skinner, cloth(!) are very welcome. But the Flow Fields is probably my favorite. You can get some really interesting stuff with it!

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